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I just got an E2. The calculator doesn't return the expected results.
For example.

10.00 + 15 % returns .25 and won't do anything when you hit =
multiplying 10.00 x 1.5 = 150 yields the correct results anybody have the same problem? Snapcalc works fine.

Thanks

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callcenterdude

try to reinstall the calculator

applejosh

Isn't the calculator built into the ROM like on every other Palm device I've had? And it does the same thing on my T5, BTW.

Edit: If I switch to advanced mode, finance calc, it produces a weird answer.
(10.00 + 15% = 12.25)

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Current: T|X, X51v, Q
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Tam Hanna

10 + ???
isnt 25% of 10 2.5??

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applejosh

Yep, that's the problem. Maybe I'm not following whatever syntax the calculator is expecting, but it's not working like every desktop calc I've used. I really don't know how PalmOne (or PalmSource or whoever wrote the calc app) could let that slip through, if it is indeed an issue. The calc app on my T3 works correctly (10 + 15% = 11.5).

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Current: T|X, X51v, Q
Previous: Palm Personal, Palm IIIxe, TRGPro, Handera H330, Sony T615c, NX70v, Zaurus SL5500, iPAQ 3955, NX80, rx3715 (second try), T|T3, T|T5 (3rd one in the warranty period, aka "the brick")

applejosh

I filled out a tech support ticket on PalmOne's site for this issue. Hopefully, I'll get some sort of a helpful response (other than the standard hard reset reply). I encourage others to do the same. Definitely not a correct behavior of a ROM based app (at least based on calculator apps of devices past).

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Current: T|X, X51v, Q
Previous: Palm Personal, Palm IIIxe, TRGPro, Handera H330, Sony T615c, NX70v, Zaurus SL5500, iPAQ 3955, NX80, rx3715 (second try), T|T3, T|T5 (3rd one in the warranty period, aka "the brick")

Antoine

I cannot remeber where I had this discussion before (either here or PIC) but the problem is not the calculator, just that it is reading your syntax correctly, instead of doing what you want it to do (confused yet?).

In some calculators, 10 + 15% is intrepreted as 10 plus 15% of 10. Of course, this is what we are asking and so it should stand to ask and get what we ask for.

However, correctly stating that same problem would mean that we would say 10 times 1.15 (since we are not looking for a smaller number but the larger one). In calculators such as the one that palmOne uses currently, 10+15% is being looked at as 10 times .15 which too is correct.

There is an algorithim that any calc uses which determines how the percentage sign is intrepreted. Though most have been modified to reflect a tendency to ask a bad question; the palmONe calc refuses that notion and gives the actual answer, instead of the expected one. Not really a bug as much as it is just a differnet way of getting things done.

In the future, I'd recommend looking at 10*1.15 as the means to write that problem out, instead of looking for the % to be intrepreted correctly (which in this case it hasnt).

*I am not a math guy; I just know about that much and not much more.

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Vidge

I saw this posted earlier and played with every possible interpretation of 10 + 15% or (10 + 15%) that I could think of and under no circumstances could I come up with either .25 or 12.25. I also tried it on my powerOne Financial calculator using all 3 available modes (order, chain & RPN) and never came up with either of those answers.

edit: Just thought of something: About the only way that 10 + 15% could come up .25 is if the 10 were interpreted as .10 and then the 15% were converted to decimal (.15). Having 10 interpreted as .10 would generally happen if you were using an add mode (like on an adding machine) with 2 decimal places as the setting. Does the calculator have an add mode?

Still no idea on the 12.25

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applejosh

Based on conversations with others, the .25 happens because it is being interpretted (as Antoine pointed out) as (10+15)% so it adds the 10 and 15 and then when you hit %, it changes the sum of those two numbers to the decimal equivalent.

Not sure why I got the funky 12.25 in financial mode, but I was corrected and told (while in financial mode) to do
10
+
%
15
=

which does produce the correct results. Unfortunately, I'm not a well paid accountant (or any kind of accountant for that matter), so I really don't have a desire to flip into advanced finance mode to figure out a tip for my dinner bill.

While I understand the theory behind it, I don't see why they made the change to the basic calculator, which used to work as a basic desktop calculator (using my T3 as an example, I'll test on others later tonight). If they want to add all sorts of fun stuff to the advanced mode, I encourage them to do so. But when they change the basic functionality to reflect a different order of operations, I think it will confuse people more than it should. I understand that I can just multiply by 1.whatever% and get the same result, but I fear change. (OK, not really, but today was just a bad day with the Palm, so I'm not very happy with it at the moment.)

But I'd be willing to forget this if they'd just fix all the other nagging things in the T5, the infamous Find bug being the main one. That one really gets me thinking about the QA process at PalmOne. (Anyone know if that little thing is still present in the E2 and LD?)

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Current: T|X, X51v, Q
Previous: Palm Personal, Palm IIIxe, TRGPro, Handera H330, Sony T615c, NX70v, Zaurus SL5500, iPAQ 3955, NX80, rx3715 (second try), T|T3, T|T5 (3rd one in the warranty period, aka "the brick")

Ricon

Here is the response I got from Palm.
She states it should work doing tap 10.00 tap + Tap % it should say 1.5 then tap = 11.50 She gave me all these things to do and it didn't change.

I then wrote them back asking if they actually tried this on an E2. There reply was call customer support. They didn't even try it on an E2 and made me jump through hoops resetting etc. for nothing. I went to 2 Staples Stores and tried 2 different E2's and the result was the same. a Zire 72 gave a result as 1,5 now that was weird LOL.

Heres what Palm said: Thank you for contacting palmOne Technical Support. My name is Cheryll and I will be assisting you with your Tungsten™ E2 Handheld. I understand that you are using the built-in calculator of your handheld and you are computing for percentages. Regarding your concern, in reference to your example, please refer to the steps below to compute for the percentage of 10 + 15%. -
Tap 10 and the plus (+) sign -
Then tap 15 and the percentage (%) sign o
Once you have tapped in the percentage sign, it should show you 1.5
Once you tapped the equals (=) sign, it should show you the answer 11.5

If your handheld is not showing you this computation, please try to do a soft reset. If this did not help, try to do a warm reset, in-cradle reset, and finally the hard reset by referring to the instructions below. The issue that you are having is typically caused if some of your handheld’s components are not working properly and need to be refreshed. There are four options that could possibly resolve this issue: soft, warm (system), in-cradle and hard reset. First try doing a soft reset and if it fails, you can try doing a warm (system) reset, in-cradle and hard reset. Please complete the steps provided below: Note: Under normal use, you should not have to use the reset button located on the back of your handheld. On rare occasions, however, your handheld may not respond to buttons or the screen. In this case, you need to perform a reset to get your handheld running again. Soft Reset Soft reset is similar to restarting a desktop computer. It's the most useful trick in your toolbox for fixing a variety of issues. Soft resets usually do not affect your personal data on your device, unless your battery is low. If see battery warnings, change or charge your batteries immediately even if there is an error message onscreen. Also, it's a good practice to perform a HotSync® operation before any reset (assuming that synchronization is not the problem you are trying to fix). Use an unfolded paper clip, or the reset tool at the tip of your stylus. To perform soft reset, gently press the RESET button inside the hole on the back panel of your device. All data on your device should be retained. If you do lose data after a soft reset, you may have a more serious issue with your hardware that requires a repair. After a soft reset, the Welcome screen appears, followed shortly by the General Preferences screen (to set time and date). If a soft reset does not resolve your problem, you may perform a warm (system) reset.

Warm (System) Reset A warm (system) reset tells your device to stop what it's doing and start over again, bypassing any system extensions. This can help you with 'boot loop' errors, and let you remove any recently installed third-party applications that might be causing the problem. Press and hold the UP button on the front panel of your device. While holding the UP button, use an unfolded paper clip, or the reset tool at the tip of your stylus, to gently press the RESET button inside the hole on the back of your device. The Palm™ Computing Platform screen will appear. Release the UP button when you see it. On some devices, you may see a palmOne™ logo and a progress bar first. Do not release the UP button until the second, circular Palm Powered logo appears. Because this reset is a bit awkward to perform, sometimes it doesn't actually happen when you think it does. Test to see if it worked: a. Open the Applications launcher. b. Choose the application named 'Prefs.' c. Access the General preferences (on some devices, you may need to access Power). d. Tap on the pick list for Beam Receive. Choose 'On.' If it still displays 'Off,' then your device was correctly system reset.
Once you've tested that the system reset worked, perform a soft reset. Otherwise, some functions will not work. If performing warm reset didn’t resolve the issue, please perform hard reset on the handheld. In-cradle reset You may need to do this to reset the charging circuitry. An in-cradle reset will reset the charging circuitry in a rechargeable device. This is helpful if your device turns off as soon as you turn it on, or if it doesn't seem to be charging when you connect it to a power source. The charger can be any type of cradle or cable that charges your device. The important bit is to make sure the power adapter is plugged in and supplying power to your device during the reset.
1. Connect your device securely to its charging cradle or cable, and connect the cradle/cable to a power source.
2. Use an unfolded paper clip, or the reset tool at the tip of your stylus.
3. Gently press the RESET button inside the hole on the back panel of your device
4. All data on your device should be retained. If you do lose data after a soft reset, you may have a more serious issue with your hardware that requires a repair.
5. After a soft reset, a logo screen appears, followed shortly by a Preferences screen asking you to set time and date. Hard Reset Note: With a hard reset, all records and entries stored in your handheld are erased. 'Formats', 'Preferences' and other settings are restored to their factory default setting.
It is recommended to make a backup copy of your handheld User information. Please proceed with the directions below: Double-click 'My Computer' on the Windows® Desktop and open the C: and navigate to Program Files. Open the Palm or Pilot folder. Right-click the User folder and select Copy. Note: The User folder is a truncated version of your User name. Click on the link below for information on how to find your handheld's User folder on your desktop computer: http://www.palmone.com/cgi-bin/cso_kbURL.cgi?ID=26674 Minimize the current open windows. Right-click an empty location of your Windows Desktop and select Paste. You should now see a backup copy of your User folder on the desktop. If you do not see a backup, please repeat steps one through five, until the backup is visible. If you have more than one handheld user synchronizing their information using the same computer, repeat steps one through five for each user.
To perform a hard reset:
1. Hold down the power button on the handheld.
2. While holding down the power button, use a small blunt object such as a paperclip, or the reset tool at the end of your stylus to gently press the reset button located inside the hole on the back panel of your handheld.
3. When the device's screen displays the Palm Computing Platform or Palm Powered logo, release the power button. On some devices, you may see a palmOne logo and a progress bar first. Do not release the power button until the second, circular Palm Powered logo appears.
4. A message will appear warning that you are about to erase all the data stored on your handheld.
5. Press the UP button to complete the hard reset, erasing everything on your device
6. Your device will then take you through a series of screens to calibrate the digitizer and verify the time and date. Note: A hard reset does not delete the current date and time. It does restore other settings to the factory default. To restore the data to your handheld after performing a hard reset, please perform a HotSync operation using ‘Desktop Overwrites Handheld for the conduit action(s) except for Install, Install service templates system, and Install to card. ‘Desktop Overwrites Handheld’ uses the information on your desktop computer to replace any information on your handheld. Typically, this option is used in restoring lost information to a handheld. To change the conduit setting, please copy and paste the address below into your web browser: http://www.palmone.com/cgi-bin/cso_kbURL.cgi?ID=26460

If the calculator function of your handheld is still not computing properly and since you have also mentioned that you have just purchased your handheld on the 20th of May, I suggest that you also try to get back to your reseller and ask for a possible handheld replacement. If these steps have not resolved your issue, you may need to set up a Service Repair Order. Service Repair Orders must be set-up by the palmOne telephone Technical Support team. This team can be reached at: 813-313-4913 Please note, support telephone calls are subject to a technical support fee of $25 per incident after 90 days from the date of purchase. However, if your call results in a Service Repair Order, or we are unable to resolve your issue, this fee will be waived.

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applejosh

Yeah, I don't think their tech support is all that. In my support ticket, I specifically stated I had a T5 (and I had already done a hard reset) and that all other models I've owned did it in such a way. I did get a response back saying to use the advanced financial calculator. Nothing was mentioned about why it suddenly changed, not that I expect that much knowledge from 1st level tech support.

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Current: T|X, X51v, Q
Previous: Palm Personal, Palm IIIxe, TRGPro, Handera H330, Sony T615c, NX70v, Zaurus SL5500, iPAQ 3955, NX80, rx3715 (second try), T|T3, T|T5 (3rd one in the warranty period, aka "the brick")

cjnewman

I've tried every combination of keys possible, in basic mode, to get the % key to work correctly and can't get th eright answer, again without going into finacnial mode. In financial mode it works as I'd expect...
i.e. 5 + % 50 = 7.5 i.e. 5 + 50% of 5....

I've had many many electronic calculators. I've had a number of palms.
I have never noticed the % key working in one mode and not in another
no matter how you look at it, the calculator is not working correctly.

As for resets. I've reset my palm more times in a week than my previous 4 palms were reset in 5+ years. There is no way a reset would resolve this problem

the calc app is badly coded. simple. OR the % key is actually doing something else.....

Ricon

Here is their latest reply. I'll use snapcalc until something better comes along. I wonder why they would change the calculator on the newer Palms. Someone asleep at the wheel again at Product Development.




Thank you for contacting palmOne Technical Support. My name is Aja and I will be assisting you today regarding the incorrect computation of the percentage function in your Tungsten™ E2. I understand that in your attempt to resolve the issue, you have tried multiple types of resets but the problem has remained unresolved.

We are quite concerned over your experience, and are sorry for any inconvenience or frustration this has caused you. We are going to do all we can to help.

I know how frustrating your experience is but before you decide on returning the handheld, I would be giving you a possible resolution to your issue.

Rick, the calculator program of your Tungsten E2 is different from the rest of the handhelds. The resolution that you would follow includes the modification of the calculator settings. For detailed instructions, please see the notes below.

Go the calculator function of your Tungsten E2.
In the calculator application, tap the menu icon on the handheld. It is located near the magnifying glass at the lower left side of the handheld screen.
The menu option would appear at the upper portion of the screen. You would see their Edit and Options.
Tap on “Options” and choose Advance Mode.
Another advance calculator application would appear.
Tap again the menu icon.
Right now you would see on the upper portion of the screen: Edit, Pref, Options.
Tap “Options” and choose “Finance Mode”.
Make sure that the words “Finance”, “Float” and “Degrees” appear below the calculator screen. If the “float” and “degrees” is not seen you could change it by tapping the menu screen and then go to “Pref” then change to “Float and Degrees”
You will be now in the finance mode of the calculator.
Input on the calculator let say 100.
Then press the desired mathematical application to be use. Let’s say “+” sign.
Tap first the “%” sign then the number 6.
Tap the equal sign; the answer should be 106.




Note: The values provided on the instructions are just examples for your own simulation.



We hope this issue has been resolved to your satisfaction. A Customer Satisfaction Survey will be emailed to you very shortly. Please take time to provide us with your feedback about this support experience as it will help us in our on-going effort to continually improve our services.



If you require further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact us again. You can also find troubleshooting articles and frequently asked questions at:



http://kb.palmone.com



To learn more about palmOne handhelds, please visit our support web site at:



http://www.palmone.com/us/support/



Thank you for choosing palmOne.



Sincerely,





Aja

palmOne Technical Support

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