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05-24-2005, 06:18 PM
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#31 | | Registered User
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 122
| As an OS advance it should become more resilient, not more brittle. Quote:
I had a T5, and it crashed at least once a day during a hotsync. It could be quickly fixed by doing a soft reset and syncing again, but I'm not willing to put up with something that crashes that much.
As far as I know, it wasn't related to third party software, and I always do a clean install of my PDAs (after learning the hard way years ago).
| http://www.palminfocenter.com/forum...bb0d4ef8df6e44f
Its always convenient to make excuses and blame 3rd party software, but tell that to all these people. ( Whats wrong with the T5? ) Apparently the T5 has a memory leak which has still not been fixed yet.
Surur
Last edited by Surur : 05-24-2005 at 06:25 PM.
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05-24-2005, 06:33 PM
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#32 | | Writer/Podcaster
Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 927
| Quote: | Originally Posted by Surur |
No leak that I've seen, but again, I don't run crappy apps, of if I do, I know what I'm doing.
But the point about OSs becoming more tolerant over time is BS and you darn well know it, Surur. Windows XP disallowed a LOT of stuff Windows 2000 allowed (ask anyone who owned a scanner prior to XP's release if they still use it) and Windows NT disallowed a lot of things that worked in Windows 3.1. You're just blowing smoke here.
Plus, explain to me how you can run any application that ran on my Jornada 540 on any current Pocket PC.
Nice try, though.
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Jeff Kirvin
Author of Between Heaven and Hell, a different kind of SF novel.
Get it at eReader http://www.ereader.com/product/detail/5493
or Fictionwise http://www.fictionwise.com/ebooks/eBook29869.htm
For the sequel, check out eSerials at http://www.serialfiction.net
Listen to the Maximum Geek Podcast!
http://www.solomedia.org/podcast/
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05-24-2005, 06:35 PM
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#33 | | Writer/Podcaster
Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 927
| And by the way, the crash after HotSync is always attributable to third party software on the T5. I've ferreted out a few of the offenders myself. ClipPro is probably the most common cause of this problem.
__________________
Jeff Kirvin
Author of Between Heaven and Hell, a different kind of SF novel.
Get it at eReader http://www.ereader.com/product/detail/5493
or Fictionwise http://www.fictionwise.com/ebooks/eBook29869.htm
For the sequel, check out eSerials at http://www.serialfiction.net
Listen to the Maximum Geek Podcast!
http://www.solomedia.org/podcast/
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05-24-2005, 06:42 PM
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#34 | | Custom User
Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 3,942
| Quote: | Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin And by the way, the crash after HotSync is always attributable to third party software on the T5. I've ferreted out a few of the offenders myself. ClipPro is probably the most common cause of this problem. |
Dont hotsync! LOL
Yes, of course Jeff, it does always help to know what you are doing when you mess up your PDA. The nice thing about mine is that it is both not computer reliant, and almost everything important is stored on the card, so I never have a problem, even if I have to do a hard reset. I could also mention that I keep two backups. I have a TealBackup backup, and MSBackup directory where all of my files are stored. I can do a general system restore from MSBackup (its alot more reliable), and then pull any other altered (updated) files off of the TB directory.
I also keep reg codes in text files on my card. You just have to tell yourself that a hard reset is no big deal. The only time I was really scared was when ZLauncher erased my zlauncher programs directory, where I had recently moved my apps. I didnt erase the file tree on my card though, so I was able to look up all of the missing files and put them back. Needless to say my programs stay in their file system now, and not in the programs directory.
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Brad Green - Enthusiast Extraordinaire...
Sony TG-50, Sony TH-55, Palm TX...TH-55 still the best
Last edited by jjesusfreak01 : 05-24-2005 at 06:45 PM.
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05-24-2005, 07:24 PM
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#35 | | Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 927
| Quote: | Originally Posted by Jeff Kirvin But the point about OSs becoming more tolerant over time is BS and you darn well know it, Surur. Windows XP disallowed a LOT of stuff Windows 2000 allowed (ask anyone who owned a scanner prior to XP's release if they still use it) and Windows NT disallowed a lot of things that worked in Windows 3.1. You're just blowing smoke here. | And even more recently, XP vs. XP w/ Service Pack 2. Properly written apps did not have nearly the problems as poorly written apps.
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Josh
Current: T|X, X51v, Q
Previous: Palm Personal, Palm IIIxe, TRGPro, Handera H330, Sony T615c, NX70v, Zaurus SL5500, iPAQ 3955, NX80, rx3715 (second try), T|T3, T|T5 (3rd one in the warranty period, aka "the brick")
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05-24-2005, 09:03 PM
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#36 | | Palmguru
Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Grand Rapids ,MI
Posts: 183
| Quote: | Originally Posted by choongyouqi so David Pogue in on the dark side! |
I 2nd this , so is it time for some emails to float over to David to express our thank you for a screwed up and unfair review. So whos with me!!
So where is the LifeDrive Avatar??? 
__________________ May the pda be with you! III>IIIXE>Vx>IIIC>M505>M515>T>T2>T3>TE> LD>back to TE>TX> thinking about it?
Last edited by tritan : 05-24-2005 at 09:09 PM.
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05-25-2005, 03:32 AM
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#37 | | Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 96
| Jeff Kirvin
talk to many developers of PalmOS applications - and u will hear that there ARE bugs with new nvfs. and it has nothing to do with 3rd party software.
Igor Nesterov (author of YAHM) talked about bugs in nvfs, and he is Profi. so i belive him.
so your opinion has nothing to do with reality.
and about win 3.1. and XP comparison (i loved 3.1) - i can say only one thing - LMAO.
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bljat'
Sony TJ-35
Last edited by prayer4eev : 05-25-2005 at 03:35 AM.
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05-25-2005, 05:51 AM
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#38 | | Evolving...
Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: New York
Posts: 545
| Quote: | Originally Posted by Surur You guys are being way to casual about these crashes. Over on PIC some-one just posted that his T5 crashes 6-9 times per day. http://www.palminfocenter.com/forum...2fd48ced#151868
Since the LifeDrive is just a T5 + HDD, I would not be surprised to see it exhibit the same behavior.
I thought Palm was all about stability?
Surur |
Surur, I've noticed your comments on PalmInfoCenter, and that (by no coincidence) PIC's forum is a more combative place. I've enjoyed 1Src for a long time as a place where people discuss rather than argue. Obviously, you're as welcome here as anyone, but please don't troll. |
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05-25-2005, 09:47 AM
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#39 | | Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 1,853
| Different hard drives IMHO.
5gig vs 4gig one... |
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05-27-2005, 11:12 PM
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#40 | | Guest | Just to clarify a few things about my review, guys. First, the 6-second delay is no myth, at least on the unit PalmOne sent me to review. Please watch my online video to see it in action!
(I did NOT say that I had a preproduction unit in the column, btw; if I did have one, PalmOne certainly never indicated as much. And I DID confirm that it had the final shipping firmware.)
Now then: As I wrote in the review, you do NOT see the lag if you're switching between a few small apps; it keeps everything in RAM. You guys keep saying how you fired up the calendar and had no lag--great! Neither do I (except after a hard reset).
But open a big Word document (which will flush most other stuff out of RAM), scroll a couple times, edit. Now try going back to the Home screen, say, or switch calendar views--I get the lag.
I am also able to trigger it with other "large" moves like visiting a couple of graphics-laden Web pages in Blazer; when I go back to other corners of the software, I hit the 6-second spinup.
You'll also see it with just about EVERYTHING when you first turn on the unit after a reset or power down.
PalmOne confirmed the syndrome with me on the phone, and even provided the explanation I paraphrased in the column.
That said, I suppose it's conceivable that there's something "special" about my unit, but I can only write about what I see.
Hope this helps!
--David Pogue | |
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05-28-2005, 08:10 AM
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#41 | | Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK
Posts: 40
| David Pogue, Thanks for copying your repsonse here as well as on the Brighthand forums. All I can say is that your report is at variance with many more positive user reports I've seen posted - in particular saying switching off and soft resets do not result in producing the lag type problem. Is it not the case that using a laptop PC with some larger docs & heavy web pages would cause similar lag issues - we are talking hard drive abilities here.... I suppose - and corrrect me if I'm wrong anyone- what you're saying is that if you fill that 32MB RAM cache with any large application or pile of data it will push out that useful buffer that cut's out the lag for all stuff that's been 'cached' until they're recached from more use. One thing though, just how big are these large documents you loaded up, it sounds like they must be pretty huge to flush that cache out.... 
__________________
Are you a Christian Pda user a Christian or just curious about Christ ? Why not check out http://mobileministrymagazine.blogspot.com/
and www.carm.org
IIIe>IIIxe>m125>m130>TT3/TE (with a wad of Bibles on board ! )
Last edited by Bibles on my T3 : 05-28-2005 at 08:21 AM.
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05-28-2005, 10:04 AM
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#42 | | Guest | pdaBuzz.com review of LD See David's interaction on the pdaBuzz.com review that completely busts the myth he's created of the LD 6 sec delay.
Basically it seems that David is using the PD in a non-realworld way that exposes a weakness of caching (which would mostly be true on ANY computing platform with caching). He's also caught out in another major misstatement as well. www.pdabuzz.com | |
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05-28-2005, 01:16 PM
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#43 | | Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Portland
Posts: 171
| Quote: | Originally Posted by Phallacy He's also caught out in another major misstatement as well. | Quote: | Originally Posted by David Pogue (I did NOT say that I had a preproduction unit in the column, btw; if I did have one, PalmOne certainly never indicated as much. And I DID confirm that it had the final shipping firmware.) |
From the NY Times article by David Pogue "(a problem PalmOne says it has fixed since sending out review units)"
I don't know if this guest really was David Pogue, no way of knowing without him being registered.
PS Just to test the scenario put forth in his post here, I made a doc file out of the entire text of Moby Dick changed the font of the entire doc (nearly doubling it's size to about 3 megs) and saved it, opened it on the LD, edited it, switched to TPCMP, watched an episode of Initial D, then was able to open the calendar and switch views with no more than the initial 2 second delay that I'd always encounter. How large are these doc files that he's opening?
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Timepilot84
Apple Newton Messagepad 130 -> Palm Pilot 5000 -> Palm III -> Palm M105 -> Sony Clie 610c -> Palm Tungsten T -> Sony Clie TH55 -> P1 Tungsten T3 -> Sharp SL-6000L -> P1 Zire 31 -> P1 Tungsten T5 -> P1 LifeDrive & Dell Axim X50v-> Palm TX -> Dell Axim X51v -> Cingular 3125 -> Nokia N800
Last edited by timepilot84 : 05-28-2005 at 01:27 PM.
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05-28-2005, 02:10 PM
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#44 | | Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: UK
Posts: 40
| Thanks chaps, that article certainly makes a lot more sense than Mr Pogues 'journalistic angle' on the issue. 
__________________
Are you a Christian Pda user a Christian or just curious about Christ ? Why not check out http://mobileministrymagazine.blogspot.com/
and www.carm.org
IIIe>IIIxe>m125>m130>TT3/TE (with a wad of Bibles on board ! )
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05-28-2005, 08:14 PM
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#45 | | Guest | That was the REAL David Pogue! That was the REAL David Pogue! I emailed him about the criticism that his review was generating and pointed him to this forum for review. The following is my email to him and hie response: Hi David, As a potential PalmOne LifeDrive customer, I read and viewed your video review of the LifeDrive with great interest, since I think you are a great tech news and review correspondent who tries to inject some humor in potentially dry and boring subject matter. I especially like watching you on the CBS Sunday Morning show. However, in comparing your review with about 10 other reviews of this device, one MAJOR discrepency has come up. This discrepancy has to do with the "six second lag" of the LifeDrive. The following is a quote from your review of the LifeDrive: "The most serious cause for pause, though, is the LifeDrive's unfortunate case of narcolepsy. To save power, the hard drive stops spinning between uses. That's fine. What's not so fine, however, is that it takes six seconds to spin up again and feed its data into the palmtop's memory so you can use it. As a result, your work is frequently interrupted by maddening, six-second visits to the dead zone. Everything is frozen on the screen, no button works and your workflow comes to a crashing halt. There's no progress bar or "wait" cursor, either - only a little light at the top of the case tells you: "Please hold; your work is very important to us." These lapses are particularly frequent just after you've turned on the LifeDrive for the very first time. Open the calendar: six seconds. Switch to Week view: six seconds. Open the address book: six seconds. Back to the Home screen: six seconds." This comment has created quite a stir in the Palm community. All the other reviews I have read talked about a typical 1-2 second delay in switching between applications. I have even demoed a production unit at a CompUSA myself and experienced a typical 1-2 second delay. A consistent 6 second delay in a PDA would be unacceptable to most people including me. I am afraid that your review has scared away potential LifeDrive customers and has tarnished PalmOne's reputation in releasing a flagship product with a serious flaw. I am wondering if you were given either a pre-production unit or a defective unit for your review? If either is the case, I would hope you consider obtaining a shipping unit and run through your speed tests again? I feel that a lot of people act (or not act) on your reviews and I would hate to see a company and product discredited because you were given a faulty product to review. The following are some shortcuts related to this issue for further clarification. Thanks for your time, Lance Article on PDABuzz.com: http://tinyurl.com/ad98g Tech Forum Threads: http://tinyurl.com/9mzu9 http://tinyurl.com/8atgp David Pogues response: The 6-second delay is no myth. Please watch my online video to see it in action! As I wrote in the review, you won't see it if you're switching between 3 small apps; it keeps everything in RAM. It is therefore NOT, as you wrote, "consistent." It is, as I wrote, occasional. But open a big Word document (which will flush most other stuff out of RAM), scroll a couple times, edit. Now try going back to the Home screen, say, or switch calendar views--you'll see the lag. I am also able to trigger it with other "large" moves like visiting a couple of graphics-laden Web pages in Blazer; when I go back to other corners of the software, I hit the 6-second spinup. You'll also see it with just about EVERYTHING when you first turn on the unit after a reset or power down. PalmOne confirmed it with me on the phone, and explained it as I did in the column. We even confirmed that I have the shipping firmware version. That said, I suppose it's conceivable that there's something "special" about my unit, but I doubt it. Hope this helps, and please feel free to pass my note along to whatever boards! David Pogue Technology columnist, The New York Times http://www.davidpogue.com http://www.missingmanuals.com ================================== Latest books: "iPhoto 5: The Missing Manual" "iMovie HD & iDVD: The Missing Manual" "Mac OS X: The Missing Manual" "Windows XP Pro: The Missing Manual," 2nd Ed. "Windows XP Home Edition: The Missing Manual," 2nd Ed. | |
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