The NX70V - the guts!

[hellraiser666]

I'm sure some of you have seen Peter's Pilot pages before, but last month he posted up a complete review of the NX70V - mostly concentrating on how it's been put together and so on. He's done a great job with the high resolution photos!

He's got other reviews on there which you may be interested in.

http://www.pstec.de/ppp/pppnx70/pppnx70.html

[Massman82]

It says it would be easy to load Win CE onto a Clie. How easy would that be?

Sure, I do not like Pocket PC, but I am curious to see how it would look with it!

Could a developer try to make something like this happen?

[jomoco5]

WOW.

That takes GUTS! I could NEVER tear my babee apart . . .

[hellraiser666]

I'm sure it will be a matter of time before someone tries Linux as well.

[Massman82]

That would be great.
Now, which talented developer will it be ;). (I'm looking at all of you!)

[Unregistered]

Peter says that the connector is the same on the NR and the NX. If this is true, why is it that the KB-11 problem exists, and that the cradles are NOT completely interchangable? Any body have specs on the NX70?

[hellraiser666]

Peter is the don! Being from an technical background myself, I love reading more about how my PDAs work - and he does a great job with the descriptions and photos.

Well done Peter if you're reading this!

[Importluva]

Same connector, different OS.

Cradles don't work because of a physical problem I think. The hump on the NX doesn't work well with the extended plastic backing of the NR's cradle.

[CrakerZ]

Doh! Of course, the NX is bigger in back!

That still doesn't explain the connector issue. I've read the threads on the keyboard issue, and it sounds like the problem is hardware, not software....then again, what do I know!

[-MV-]

as it is, it's because the NR and NX run different OSes, the keyboard is unable to run in OS5, it needs new drivers or somethin

[n2ifp]

The keyboard on the NR and NX look the same to me. :)

I can interchange either one in either cradle. Just the NX dosen't fit physically as well on the NR cradle. The 3rd party serial cable works the same on both units. I have no idea how people can say it's a hardware problem without any information.

[daveytr]

A very talented man. I hope he got it back together. It does make for some pretty good reading.

[cwai02]

I am using my NX70V on a NR70 cradle, without any problem.

[OcellNuri]

Originally posted by -MV-
as it is, it's because the NR and NX run different OSes, the keyboard is unable to run in OS5, it needs new drivers or somethin

Think Outside, the company that produces the Stowaway keyboard, has actually come out and said that Sony changed the "data-line" in the connector on the NX, and that the current T/NR series keyboard will not be able to work with the NX because of this change. I have both a NR cradle and the NX cradle. I have only synced with my NX in the NX cradle so far, so I havn't checked whether it will work in the NR cradle. I do use it to charge sometimes. Has anyone gotten the NX to sync in the NR cradle?

[SW Geek]

If the HW (attached to the Clie) has a pull-up resistor on the serial data line (into the PDA), the HW will work with the NX (and other T-Series connector PDAs).

If you look at the serial data line into the NX, you will notice (if your HW does not have the pullup) that the line does not come up very quickly. It does come up with the earlier models with the same connector.

The NX and NR _can_ use the same dock. Most (if not all of) the docks are USB - Not serial. Even if they were serial, if they had that pull-up, things would work.

You can bet that before Sony branded the KB, they approved the electronics and made sure they met specs. I understand that the specs for the connector were changed AFTER the NX was released and the NX was released AFTER the KB11 was available in the market.

Fellowes showed their branded version of the Stowaway (and StowawayXT) at CES (last week). The KBs that Fellowes showed worked with the NX.

[OcellNuri]

Oh, ok. So it wasn't a change in the usb circuit, just the serial circuit. I'll admit I don't know much about developing hardware, but I do understand that the unit has to switch between usb and serial modes by a voltage applied to a certain pin, and this is what the resistor is for right?

What do you mean by "HW"?

This is interesting... I have the facility to learn a lot if you are willing to explain :D

[n2ifp]

Originally posted by OcellNuri
Oh, ok. So it wasn't a change in the usb circuit, just the serial circuit. I'll admit I don't know much about developing hardware, but I do understand that the unit has to switch between usb and serial modes by a voltage applied to a certain pin, and this is what the resistor is for right?

What do you mean by "HW"?

This is interesting... I have the facility to learn a lot if you are willing to explain :D

Something to ponder, the same serial cable works on both the NR and NX when using it with a Nextel phone or as a dumb terminal that my brother uses for some function at his work. Now it is possible that the serial converter has a pullup voltage or something that compensates for it.

Between you and SW Geek, I am getting a better idea of what is going on.

[CrakerZ]

Am I to assume you are referring to the RXD line on pin 13? The (old?) specs indicate this line is pulled up inside the PDA. I have not seen any "new" specs. Does any one know where these are available?

I am also concerned about why the Hot Sync is activated when the keboard is attached. That would seem to indicate that line is being pulled LOW by the keyboard (pin 11).

I do believe that more information is needed. If someone has done some experimentation/examination, please share *detailed* info. I'm getting frustrated with just hearing bits and pieces that assume everybody knows what everyone else is talking about! :) Not all of us have access to data scopes ;)

[OcellNuri]

Ok, well when I set my NX into my Belkin keyboard it doesn't start a hotsync. Does this mean the Belkin isn't affected by this change in hardware?

[SW Geek]

CrakerZ/OcellNuri:
The Stowaway KB send a HS signal _every_ time it wakes up due to someone typing a key. If the Driver 'sees' the KB, it eats the signal, opens the Serial port and does key processing. If the Driver does not 'see' the KB, it allows the HS signal to be process by the OS. The Serial port is open for some number of seconds after the last key typed. This make the Stowaway _seriously_ power stingy and allows the Driver to be enabled all the time and still have the PDA work with other attached 'things' (like your cradle).

I do not believe that ANY other KB closes the Serial port (saving power) while still being enabled and allowing the users to HotSync or type at will.

CrakerZ:
I don't have the spec here to look at and RXD and TXD labels are relative. The line I am talking about is the line used to send serial data INTO the PDA. It had an internal pull-up on it for all the other T-Series connector PDAs, but not for the NX. If your external HW does not pull-up the line on the NX, your SW will read garbage (at 9600 and lower) from whatever is attached to the PDA.

[vansouza]

I bought two of them when I got my NR and when I got the NX I continued to use the NR cradel at work... Use the NX cradel at home... no issues discovered. ps... is the spell checker working on the site?

[CrakerZ]

SW Geek, the specs are available at:

http://leggnet.com/clie/Ifcndke3.pdf

It appears that, according to what you have said, that the NX doesn't, in fact, pull the RXD line up internally, as the specs indicate. If that is so, then following the example given in the specs, a 100K pull-up between pin 13 and pin 10 would solve that problem. Of course, none of this means anything if the driver isn't compatible with OS5.