Civilization for Palm...

[Massman82]

As you guys probably already know, Redshift is developing a Palm OS version of Mobile Civilization.

It will be:
1) Able to work in Landscape mode (480x320) or regular
2) Hi-res (both 320x320 and 480x320)
3) OS 5 compatible.

They MAY or may not create a lo-res or grayscale version. (There may not be enough heap memory and the graphics will be tough to create...they still may do it though :))

Tell them: what was your favorite feature of Civilization? What do you want in the Palm version?
Or you can just put a good word in for Redshift!

[Phalanx]

First off, how true will it be to the original Civ? Are all the features going to be implemented? And what about sound? I hope they don't use crappy PC speaker beeps for sound, like 99.99% of all Palm games do. Yes, I, too am excited for Civ for Palm!

[TheMooch]

Judging by the screenshots for the Nokia version, it'll be almost exactly the same as the orginal version. I'm planning on Registering DragonFire just to help fund it. :) They have a list on the site of upcoming project ports the are considering. Among them are Colonization, Eye of the Beholder (which I personally can't wait for) and a few others. If they're successful, they're going to make a BIG name for themselves in the Palm gaming arena.

[Massman82]

It will most likely (99% sure) have cool sounds!
They will probably be in an add-on PDB to save space (and then there could be customizable sounds)

Buying Dragonfire to support Civ is a great idea, since their located in Hungary and if the economy in the US is not good, imagine how it is over there!
(Their site may be down right now, I think their moving to a much faster server)

[Phalanx]

They better include the "dun da" sound when you win an attack, and the "dun dun" when you lose. Plus, each Civ has their own theme music when you do diplomacy, they better add that too! :D

[mshaf]

sound will be interesting since dragonfire never had it

[Massman82]

Everything suggested in this thread will probably be considered. I will send it over to them later.

How about this: An optional Music.pdb file and an optional SoundFX.pdb file for only enhanced sound machines.

That way it will satisfy your needs and still conserve space for those who do not need sound. (After all, Civ is a fairly large game, they say it will only be about as large as Dragonfire since they developed a new compression algorithm :))

[Massman82]

Originally posted by mshaf
sound will be interesting since dragonfire never had it

They did not have time to add it (I think)

Civilization seemed more important then Dragonfire 1.2!

[mshaf]

no what they told me was that they did not have the coding yet from Sony to develop it for the nx. I doubt they ever got it

[TheMooch]

Don't forget they're developing for multiple platforms. The Version of Civ they have right now is for the okia phones with the really wide screens.

[Massman82]

Thats true about the widescreen Nokia. (That's why they are also supporting landscape mode. That is the NR/NX in a sideways view with the VG area collapsed)

I have a few 320x320 screenshots (They are samples from nine days ago...not real but it's how it will look)
They should appear on PDArcade sometime on Saturday of next week :).

[Massman82]

No more questions/suggestions???

[omniphil]

Originally posted by philipv
First off, how true will it be to the original Civ? Are all the features going to be implemented? And what about sound? I hope they don't use crappy PC speaker beeps for sound, like 99.99% of all Palm games do. Yes, I, too am excited for Civ for Palm!


It will be very very close as I already have the civ version on my nokia 9290 and was very impressed to see how close it was to the original pc game...

[Kleejam]

I'd like to be able to run it from an external card/MS...

[ilkera]

I think the game should be played on MS (or VFS generally)
I would not want to give a huge space from RAM.

[Kleejam]

I think a port of CivIII (vs. earlier versions) would be best.

[Massman82]

It's also the most unlikely and the worst choice.

Short answer: Will not happen in the next two years on any pda. (Unless it is very scaled down.

Civilization II could work though...For now Civilization I is the target and no others will be considered since Civ I is already well into development.

[pkhliu]

I am so excited the new game Civ from Redshift.

Here are a few information I got from Redshift in the last two months:
1. Redshift developers said they will add sound and support 320x480 to DragonFire but they want a working version out first.  (No timeline though.)
2. Their current site is rediculously slow.  They are moving to new site in couple weeks.  That's what I was told couple days ago.
3. I don't know about the Civ but DragonFire can be run from memory stick.  However, there will still be about 150K of data file store in your palm main memory.

About enhancement on Civ:
1. Definitely it has to run on 320x480 with full color and/or landscape mode.
2. Support OS5 new features
3. Action sound would be nice (Like Bejeweled's latest version).  I don't know about the theme songs is that important.
4. Run on memory stick is a must becuase it is just way to big.
5. Break the game into multiple pdb files if possible.  (As someone has suggested earlier.)

From the quality of the DragonFire, I am willing to pay for the Civ even if it is beta version.  (Lifetime free upgrade is presumed.)

Last, does anyone collecting this inforamtion and reflect back to Redshift developers?  If not, what's the point of this features/enhancements discusstion?

[pkhliu]

Originally posted by Massman82
Short answer: Will not happen in the next two years on any pda. (Unless it is very scaled down.

What about break the game into multiple themes, i.e. pdb?  Would that work?

[Massman82]

Don't worry, all of this will get to the folks at Redshift.
I am in very close contact with them at this time.

Short answer to breaking Civ 3 down into multiple files: No!
The graphics are too advanced for the Palm. It would run too slow.
If it was possible with speed and memory, the development time would be ridiculous.

I can see a version of Civ I/II with the same technology tree/units as Civ III but not the same graphics.

[TheMooch]

Don't worry, all of this will get to the folks at Redshift.
I am in very close contact with them at this time. </QUOTE>

Did they happen to mention a soft date for release?

(Let's hope it's not like Duk Nuke'em Whenever) :D

[TheMooch]

hehe, gotta lurn the quote trick...........:D

[Massman82]

You can still edit your post. Change the <> to brackets ( [ ] )

They did not mention a release date. That means - it will be released on time :). (Don't worry, they released Dragonfire 4 days after they promised to release it!)

That means when they say about 1 - 2 months it will probably be out in 2 months :).

[hansschmucker]

Sorry but I just can't stand Civilisation: it's slow and complex then it would have to be. Generally: boring. At least in my opinion.

However the underlying game engine might be of interest as it would allow to port other games quickly to multiple platforms.

"The Settlers" - Die Siedler would be my greatest wish for a palm game. It's fun, it's easy, it's long, it's small when measured in MB (And I'm talking about a PC version without real compression and a full featured intro: < 7MB), it's fast (You could play in 640x480 on a 386!), it supports split-screen multiplayer (via 2 mice) and last but not least: I love it!

Any comments on that? Was the US version popular? It was popular in Germany, that's for sure!

[Massman82]

That could be a possibility for the future, but for now they are working on Civilization and nothing else :).

Email that to them in 3 months and they would probably consider it.

(Not everyone has to like a certain game!)

[TheMooch]

My vote goes to Eye of the Beholder!!!!

[Massman82]

Hehe, I think they want to update Dragonfire after Civ first. (Hi-res+, sounds, (maybe) animations for OS 5, along with other things i'm sure.)

Then, I am not sure, but they might be planning their own RPG.

[TheMooch]

OK, well if you twist my ARM...(pun intended) I'll accept it. But I still wanna see it! :D

[Massman82]

lol let's take one game at a time! :) :) :)l

[Massman82]

Do you guys think sound/music is essential?

[Massman82]

They just emailed me a preview of the new site on the server (it's VERY fast!) :) Should be available very soon too.

I looked at the plans page and they have a couple of games there. Two of which are Eye of the Beholder and Settlers.
They probably won't make all of the games listed...probably only one-maybe two. So the one that is most popular will be developed. (My opinion, not from them)

[Phalanx]

Originally posted by Massman82
Do you guys think sound/music is essential?

Sound is ESSENTIAL! Well, that's my opinion, I'd love the sound. But music would be great, but should be optional. Sound will add more depth to the game IMO.

[pkhliu]

Originally posted by philipv


Sound is ESSENTIAL! Well, that's my opinion, I'd love the sound. But music would be great, but should be optional. Sound will add more depth to the game IMO.

I totally agree.&nbsp;

[Massman82]

I sent all of these ideas over to Redshift and here are some questions from them:

- Do you know somebody who has kinda samples for each civilization ? Not an easy job to find musics on the net...
- The sounds will be in a separate pdb, ok
- I'm sure we can have only 320x320, 320x480, 480x320 versions in a single application, because it's almost impossible to redesign the game into 160x160. I tried it... memory. 200 kB free heap is very low, Civ needs about 500 kB (or more) - using feature (store) memory is very slow
- I think Beholder will be the next one, with add-on levels. Based on the Dragonfire's experiences, users need longer games for their money.

If someone has wav samples of the "dun dun" sounds, send them!

[pkhliu]

Originally posted by Massman82
- I think Beholder will be the next one, with add-on levels. Based on the Dragonfire's experiences, users need longer games for their money.


I like what I heard so far.

Just one question, does it mean there will be no "expension pack/sequel/add-on level" for Dragonfire and Civ?:(

[Massman82]

No.

It will be their next new games. I'm sure they will update Dragonfire...

[Phalanx]

Originally posted by Massman82
I sent all of these ideas over to Redshift and here are some questions from them:

- Do you know somebody who has kinda samples for each civilization ? Not an easy job to find musics on the net...
- The sounds will be in a separate pdb, ok
- I'm sure we can have only 320x320, 320x480, 480x320 versions in a single application, because it's almost impossible to redesign the game into 160x160. I tried it... memory. 200 kB free heap is very low, Civ needs about 500 kB (or more) - using feature (store) memory is very slow
- I think Beholder will be the next one, with add-on levels. Based on the Dragonfire's experiences, users need longer games for their money.

If someone has wav samples of the "dun dun" sounds, send them!

Massman82! I'm your man! If you (I mean Redshift) can give me some time, I will get all the sounds and civ theme songs. I have a copy somewhere.

[Massman82]

Great! Email them to me at Massman82@PDArcade.com
Also, you have a month tops!...Fine! I'll give you one and a half...(I'm sure you will have them within a week or two though!)

All of them will definitely not be used though...

[Massman82]

Civ needs about 500 kB (or more) - using feature (store) memory is very slow

Is there any programmer know how to get more heep memory from a device? Unfortunately, because of the shortage of heap memory in most/all lo-res devices, it might not be possible to create a lo-res version but.... A LOT of people in the Palm OS world use lo-res devices!

[rlc7254]

Originally posted by Massman82
I sent all of these ideas over to Redshift and here are some questions from them:


&nbsp;

What is Redshift's URL????:confused:

[Massman82]

Their URL is www.redshift.hu
The move to a new server is finally complete for them! :)

[Dracus]

Any chance of haveing the real civilization or advance civilization on a palm? I may be a purest but I always thought that sid myers had a narrow vision of the real game.

[Instigator]

how about a populous clone??

[Massman82]

What do you meen? They are porting Civilization I.

They created their own artwork (none was taken from the original) and everything is their own (including texts)

Too see screenshots of the Communicator version go here: http://www.redshift.hu/civ.htm

Also, provide links when you give ideas for clones please! :)

[Instigator]

oops here ya go http://www.populous.ea-europe.com/

[Massman82]

Does screenshots look nice but I do not know how well it work on Palm's resolution (even hi-res+) and how fast it would run. (It may run on the NX and TT but probably not on any others and that really narrows the market for now!)