AvantGo? Handstory? Isilo(x)? Plucker?

[Srevets]

Hi all,  I've been reading all the threads (and I mean ALL the threads) on a web clipping, page content downloading, ebook reading, image viewing, auto-updating, (you get the idea) application. 

Since there seems to be an "each to his/her own" attitude about the application of preference, and since I was not able to discover any polls that addressed this issue, I felt compelled to post one and let the good folks here at Cliesource give a rating/opinion of their favorite app.

Recognizing that I may have overlooked an application, the four that were mentioned most often are the ones I have entitled in my post. Here's your chance to share your experience/recommendation with the rest of us who have not made that commitment to purchase/use to date.

I plan to "try out" plucker and isilo over the next week or so and forgo avantgo due to the no hi-res support (can you believe that?!) and handstory trial since most feel the trial version is useless.

Thanks so much to all who voice their opinion, share their feelings/passion, or explain why one is THE best choice for them.

Regards... 

Steve

[mdharris]

I have tried HandStory, iSilo, and AvantGo. AvantGo is nice but still having issues. iSilo was nice and great quality but was not to thrilled with their desktop and conversion. Love HandStory easy to use and love clipping anything I want to read. Try all of them and figure out what fits your needs.

The HandStory trial is useless but get the full version and you will love it. I had a hard time swallowing the trial thing at first.

[rhart00]

handstory=isilo>plucker>avantgo. I honestly like handstory, isilo, and plucker. Avantgo on the other hand I can't deal with. not hires+ and also only allows you to download 2mb of clippings. that may seem like a lot but it really isn't. I use handstory for daily news clippings but isilo for other stuff that i don't download daily (ebooks, informational websites, etc). I have just recently begun to look at plucker. looks very nice but handstory and isilo are some tough competition.

[hherbzilla]

I've tried them all in the past and ended up using Handstory. I found isilo and plucker difficult to use. Handstory is user-friendly and very flexible.

[Srevets]

Ok, I'm not that uninformed that I can't get a program to work, but I have spent an hour trying to be able to read anything on my newly installed Plucker software.  What am I doing wrong??   (kstuart... where are youuuu? :D )

I have an nx70v and have loaded the software on the desktop, installed to the handheld and updated channel content.  I can "see" the files on my clie, but the application on my handheld shows an empty list.. nothing, nil, nada, zilch.  I installed and uninstalled both to RAM and to the MS, both results the same.

Well, off to try iSilo until somebody has heart enough to rescue me from my plucker fiasco.

Regards...

[notmuch]

I love iSilo, but I think Avantgo is still the best choice for the masses.

- the most point and click content.. by far.
- 2.5 MB free.

[rhart00]

Originally posted by notmuch
I love iSilo, but I think Avantgo is still the best choice for the masses.

- the most point and click content.. by far.
- 2.5 MB free.

Handstory
-hires+
-ton of content
-unlimited mb free
-better customization

[*YellowRose*]

Originally posted by notmuch
I love iSilo, but I think Avantgo is still the best choice for the masses. You're probably right.  It doesn't require any thought to set up... 

BUT, it is my opinion that thanks to the info available at www.turcic.com (http://www.turcic.com), there are MORE sites available for iSilo than Avantgo.

 

[timw_de]

Handstory definitely, although I still use Avantgo for a couple of sites (If only it were faster)

[mdharris]

All sites at AvantGo and Turcic (for iSilo) can be used for HandStory. I do not think Web Sites should be a problem for any of the software it comes down to pref for the user.

[ballistic]

I think Handstory is one of the best apps available for the Palm IMHO. I converted from Avantgo and find Handstory to be superior in every category. Hi-Res + color support on my NX70V, runs fine from the MS using PowerRun, clips/renders webpages and images beautifully.

Thing only area I would like to see improvement is more control of my automatic clipping schedule. I'd like to be able to customize when automatic clips are updated, or have an option to update on the fly during hotsync.

[rhart00]

Originally posted by ballistic
I think Handstory is one of the best apps available for the Palm IMHO. I converted from Avantgo and find Handstory to be superior in every category. Hi-Res + color support on my NX70V, runs fine from the MS using PowerRun, clips/renders webpages and images beautifully.

Thing only area I would like to see improvement is more control of my automatic clipping schedule. I'd like to be able to customize when automatic clips are updated, or have an option to update on the fly during hotsync.

couldn't have said it better myself

[Telhai]

Easy for me...(and it is the same as some previous posts)...

For userability out of the box - Avantgo; it's the one I'd put on the Chairman's Clie and be pretty confident it'll do what is says on the box...(but)

- it aint High Res
- it aint got the power a 'power-user' wants

So for me it's got to be iSilo with iSilox; it may be a little more hands on to get it going but as Socrates said:

'Patience is bitter; but its fruit is sweet'

So toss your granny a copy of Avantgo but come to grips with iSilo to reap serious reweards.

[jbarr]

HandStory!!!

What first pushed me to HandStory was that AvantGo wouldn't work through our firewall here at work. Yes, I know that settings can be changed, but I just couldn't get it to work. Because HandStory clips the pages directly from the web sites instead of going through a third-party site (aka AvantGo) clipping is a no-brainer.

Once I tried it, I was hooked. No turning back, no regrets. HandStory has let me eliminate several apps because it is all-in-one. The cool thing is that unlike many all-in-one apps, HandStory is executed well. Its design is elegant yet I believe that it maintains the "Zen of Palm" style. The Desktop interface used to clip is simple, feature-filled, and so easy to use.

That said, I would love to see a few "updates" to HandStory that, in my opinion, would make it much more productive: (Some of these suggestions are very Sony Clie NX/NZ-specific, but they could be adapted to other PalmOS platforms.)

In my order of preference:
1. View native .jpg images from the Memory Stick. This would let us view photos taken with the NX/NZ camera and effectivly eliminate the need for a separate viewer program like AcidImage or the Clie Viewer. Support for other image types would be nice, but not essential. ARM support would be nice but not essential.

2. Schedule when and how often sites are auto-updated. Currently, they are updated once per day in the morning. I would love to see a much more user-definable solution. Not just for updating the whole batch, but individual updates. For example, I only need to update my Move Showtimes clips once a week or so, but I would like to have the News clips update a couple times during the day..

3. Add the ability to zoom in/out of images using the Jog Dial like the AcidImage and the Clie Viewer apps do. Currently, you can define the final image in various ways, but if the converted image is "oversized" than you can only view it by "panning". A nice Zoom option using the Jog Dial would be most excellent.

4. To the Memo editor/viewer, I would love to see encryption added ala MemoSafe. MemoSafe, in my opinion, is one of the best and most essential apps for my Clie. It lets me keep sensitive data encrypted in a standard MemoPad database while maintaining full MemoPad functionality and compatibility including HotSync. MemoSafe is inexpensive, stable, and reliable. There may be better encryption programs out there, but MemoSafe is seamless. My only complaint is that it currently doesn't support HiRes+ yet. Anyway, integrating something like this would eliminate my need for MemoSafe. Yes, HandStory does manage security using the Palm Security model, and you can hide/unhide content from within the program, but the data istself, especially Memo data is NOT encrypted. Not an essential feature request, but useful.

[gyffes]

Well, I just UNinstalled all references to Mobi-software.. its translation of HTML docs was awful.. even when I did the HTML conversion m'self (applescript in Tex-Edit), Mobi just messed it up.

AND, the stinkin' newsclippin' service would seek out updates fine... and then nothing would appear on Fred after hotsync. Massively annoying, esp after several reinstalls.

I like iSilo and will continue to use it, 'though many of the links I grabbed off'net (thanks anyway, Turcic) seem not to work half the time.

Based on this dialogue, though, I've grabbed HandspringSuite ($5.00 off for 'spring'!) and hope it's as good as it's advocates advocate.

[notmuch]

Originally posted by rhart00


Handstory
-hires+
-ton of content
-unlimited mb free
-better customization

Handstory is a great product, no disrespect intended. I still think Avantgo is the best product for the average Joe Blow.

- Avantgo has 4 times more preconfigured sites, no need to mess with a desktop program.
- vast majority of users don't have hires+
- 2.5MB is a considerable amount of content for the average user

[KCoram]

I used to be a big Avantgo user, but I stopped when I got my NX since it didn't support HiRes+ at the time. (Does it, yet?)

I got the "unofficial" HiRes+ version of Plucker working and use it for all of the news sites that I currently care to download for later off-line reading. I doubt I'll go back to Avantgo for that, even once they do support HiRes+ and fast memory card access. Plucker is working just fine for that.

For quick snapshots of web pages, I use HandStory Suite. Its integration with IE is really nice, and having a single app for Memos, Docs, and Web Clips is too. I was using it to clip maps from Yahoo as well, but turning a 76K jpeg into a 500+ K image file kind of sucks. For images, I'm sticking with AcidImage. Now, if HandStory comes to support native images, I may reconsider that last point ... :)

[turcic.com]

Originally posted by gyffes
I like iSilo and will continue to use it, 'though many of the links I grabbed off'net (thanks anyway, Turcic) seem not to work half the time

Strange, gyffess, but I try to keep the list very up-to-date so the links should (or most of them) be working. Whenever you find a non-working link, I would be more than happy if you could inform us on http://www.turcic.com/forums and we will try to fix'em :D

Btw, I made my own HandStory-iSilo (biased, I admit) comparison some time ago, you can see it here (http://www.turcic.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=257).

[DrMrlf]

I use Avantgo, mostly because I'm lazy and I would rather have pre-configured content... no hassle.

[jimod]

Handstory, all the features, Especially HiRes support!!!!

[xyeta]

I just want to give props to T U R C I C . C O M...once I got everything all figured out, I realized that there is a whole facet of my Clie I was under utilizing! Thanks a million! I am a regular iSilo web clipper now, thanks to your site and tutorials.

Bravo!

[eric2002]

I use iSilo... it's the only program I know of that works w/ Hi-Res Windows, and mac os 8.6, 9.2, and os X.
Also it works awesome!
Avantgo is very very limited.

[turcic.com]

New iSiloX Beta is out :9

Check here http://www.turcic.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=443

and here http://www.isilox.com/info/beta/index.htm

[*YellowRose*]

iSiloX 3.35b1 adds the following features:

iSiloX Clipper for Internet Explorer 5.0 or later. The iSiloX setup by default installs the iSiloX Clipper application to Internet Explorer, adding an icon to Internet Explorer's toolbar. iSiloX Clipper allows easy conversion of content as the user browses within Internet Explorer. The user can either select part of a page to convert or convert the entire page. In both cases, all applicable options normally available within iSiloX are also available, as well as the ability to follow links.
Added support for automatic scheduling of iSiloX using Windows Task Scheduler to perform scheduled conversions for document lists with entries having scheduled conversions set.
Added support for automatic scheduled conversions within iSiloX when a document list is open and one or more entries have a scheduled conversion that is due.
Added Scheduling property page to the Properties dialog for specifying conversion schedules for documents. Each individual document can have one or more schedules for conversion. Schedules can be of the following types:

Once: A Once schedule is a scheduled conversion that occurs once at a specified date and time.
Daily: A Daily schedule is a scheduled conversion that occurs at a specified time of the day either once every specified number of days or on one or more chosen days of the week every week. A Daily schedule can also have an effective start and/or end date and time.
Weekly: A Weekly schedule is a scheduled conversion that occurs at a specified time of the day on a specified day of the week either once every specified number of weeks or on one or more chosen weeks of the month every month. A Weekly schedule can also have an effective start and/or end date and time.
Monthly: A Monthly schedule is a scheduled conversion that occurs at a specified time of the day on a specified day of the month either once every specified number of months or on one or more chosen months of the year every year. A Monthly schedule can also have an effective start and/or end date and time.
Always: A document with an Always schedule is converted whenever a scheduled conversion occurs such that at least one document entry in the list has a due next conversion time. An Always schedule can also have an effective start and/or end date and time.

Added options for removing horizontal padding to the Margins property page of the Properties dialog. The available padding options are:

Keep all left and right padding
Ignore all left and right padding
Ignore only left and right padding specified on body
Ignore only left and right padding specified on body, division, and paragraph blocks

Added command line option -s for starting a scheduled conversion.
Added command line sub-options p, s, and e for the -H option to selectively hide the progress dialog, successful conversion message, and error conversion message, respectively.
For the source and destination properties, the Delete key can be used to delete items.

[sUnShInE]

Since we're throwing props down, I wanna give a serious shout out for the folks at iSilo.

They obviously glean alot of their info out of user comments and such by reading the forums on Alex's site, and are swiftly working to meet user needs. Almost every upgrade noted in YR's post above is something that we've discussed. Know another software co that does that?

In short, they rock. :)


Off to download and write new tutorials for Turcic.com. Stop by if you haven't already....

[philipx]

I would really like to have screen rotation in iSilo. I love the way it displays tables (can Handstory do HTML tables?), but sometimes the original page is too wide to go on my screen so I'd love to be able to rotate it and take advantage of NR's 480 screen.

[Telhai]

Turcic and Isilo are very very good; I only downloaded iSilo after getting fed up with the piss-poor avantgo response to higher res (why they continue to stick with 320x320 is beyond me..)

Anyway after playing with isilo for a couple of days and checking out the fantastic forums at turcic I am sold.

Bye bye avantgo - hello isilo

[*YellowRose*]

Originally posted by philipx
I would really like to have screen rotation in iSilo.That's a really neat feature of Repligo.  There aren't many apps that will do that on OS5.  It would be cool if iSilo could . . . ::sigh::

[Srevets]

Originally posted by turcic.com
New iSiloX Beta is out :9

Check here http://www.turcic.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=443

and here http://www.isilox.com/info/beta/index.htm

I've been watching this thread with great interest - after all I created it! :D  My question is: Since iSiloX came out with the new beta, does that eliminate one of the primary arguments from Handstory advocates? Namely, web clipping.

My experience so far has yielded that although iSilo requires a greater learning curve, it seems to have a higher level of configurarability (scheduling, cookies, etc.), support through turcic.com (Thanks Alex et all!), and a broad following of enthusiastic users that seem to be very loyal, not to mention willing to help those of us that have less experience.

One thing I don't appreciate is that Handstory's creators force you to buy the full version prior to being able to see all the functionality it has to offer.

I am still undecided at this point, but would welcome comments and feedback regarding these issues.

Regards...

[donaldekelly]

AvantGo has 320x480 as of March 26th, 2003

(I have no experience with the other web clippers, etc.)

[kstuart]

After spending several days with the new iSiloX beta and iSilo, I went back to Plucker (http://www.plkrg.org and http://hires.plkr.org for the HiRes+ Viewer).

(I did not evaluate HandStory because of their use of a crippled trial version, which doesn't let me evaluate the program before purchase.)

Here is my evaluation. Note that this is just my personal impression, and is not designed to provoke arguments about the individual points - a lot of this is subjective and depends of what someone uses the programs for.

====================

Plucker advantages over iSilo
------------------
- Up to 35% smaller file size on PDA (I list this first because it is a big one)
- Better font management (iSilo sometimes has an unusable font size that needs to be manually adjusted in the settings for that individual document)
- Date column in document list (allows instant recognition and selection of new documents)
- Comes with exclusion list pre-installed for dozens of major ad websites
- Formats web pages in a more practical fashion; iSilo's unique multi-column output is more accurate than Plucker's single column output, but it is difficult and inconvenient to pan left and right to read text in multi-column mode (that mode is really only valuable for charts and maps), and when iSilo converts to single-column mode, the result is more poorly formatted than Plucker.
- Shows which links have already been visited
- Two different checkboxes to restrict links either to the same subdomain only, or else to restrict links to the same domain only (allowing any subdomain, which is actually more useful).
- Freeware

iSilo advantages over Plucker
----------------
- IE Toolbar icon to convert page (Plucker requires a cut-and-paste of URL in channel)
- Checkbox in iSiloX to only allow subfolder links (Plucker requires a cut-and-paste of URL in exclusion/inclusion list).
- All iSilo files and DOC files can be globally searched using iSilo
- Cut-and-paste (but this feature has already been coded for Plucker and will appear soon)
- iSilo has no limit on image sizes - Plucker has a 60K uncompressed limit on images (but the Plucker Viewer developer is currently working on code to allow unlimited image size)

PS There may be other factors that I have missed, simply because they are not relevant to my use. (In fact, global search is not anything that I have ever needed, because I use DOC files and Plucker solely for reading, and have always put reference material in Memopad instead of DOC files. However, I included it because it has been mentioned by other people.)

[kstuart]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by philipx
I would really like to have screen rotation in iSilo.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by *YellowRose*
That's a really neat feature of Repligo.  There aren't many apps that will do that on OS5. 

PalmReader (freeware) does this.

[Noodles Hovar]

I'm back to AvantGo after purchasing Handstory.

I found that with Handstory I was basically trying to re-create what I already had on Avantgo.

And now that Avantgo 5.2 beta works full screen on my NR70 (it's not supposed to!) I'm happy (not counting missing $19.95).

[philipx]

Originally posted by kstuart


PalmReader (freeware) does this.

I know it does, but unfortunatelly the PalmDoc format provides no support for tables.

[jthompson]

I like iSilo because I use it to for converted Word HTML documents like clinical practice guidelines for my own and others' use. Allows for hotlinking around a document and enough custom formatting to make reading plain text very easy. I don't use my Palm to connect to the Internet and read webpages, however, so I cannot comment on that aspect.

My main complaint is that editting even plain text HTML in Word is a bit cumbersome, but I find the iSilox converter easy to use for updating documents. Wish it had a clearer way to rename the target document, but that's minor.

[kstuart]

Jim - Plucker does exactly the same thing, in fact, coincidentally, the sample Plucker document included with Plucker Desktop is called "Clinical Exam" and in fact there is a web site:

http://clinicalexam.com/

which has right on the front page a picture of a Clie running Plucker with the Clinical Exam document opened, complete with hotlinks to the various sorts of problems, anatomy, etc.

[PDH LA]

Originally posted by Noodles Hovar
I'm back to AvantGo after purchasing Handstory.

I found that with Handstory I was basically trying to re-create what I already had on Avantgo.

And now that Avantgo 5.2 beta works full screen on my NR70 (it's not supposed to!) I'm happy (not counting missing $19.95).

While it DOES work in full-screen on the NR70, the low-res fonts look absolutely horrible. I, too, would switch back to Avantgo if I didn't have to deal with the awful fonts in the Hi-res+ version.

[mdharris]

I am still stuck on HandStory. I am a clipping fool..... Everytime I see something on the web or email that I want to read later I just clip it, takes 2 seconds. This feature alone is awesome and very nice tool.

[gyffes]

Why oh Why does neither iSilo nor Handspring take advantage of the 480 screen and allow us landscape viewing??

Mobipocket > shudder < does this -- and given how poorly it does everything else, y'imagine it can't be THAT hard a feature to add...


GIMME LANDSCAPE OR.. um.. drat.

[turcic.com]

You may also want to read my own review, "How does Plucker (free) compare to iSilo (commercial)?" here (http://www.turcic.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=492) in the turcic.com forum.

Greets

Alex

[jthompson]

Originally posted by gyffes
Why oh Why does ... iSilo ... [not] take advantage of the 480 screen and allow us landscape viewing??&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; HEAR-HEAR!!

[turcic.com]

Originally posted by gyffes
Why oh Why does neither iSilo nor Handspring take advantage of the 480 screen and allow us landscape viewing??

Mobipocket > shudder < does this -- and given how poorly it does everything else, y'imagine it can't be THAT hard a feature to add...


GIMME LANDSCAPE OR.. um.. drat.

You can try to express you wish here (http://www.turcic.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=11), you know, sometimes wishes are fulfilled :)