Sony's most innovative PDA?

[Jeffry]

What do you think is the most innovative/influential CLIE in Sony's PDA lineup?

I think that the NR70v is pretty innovative... since it's the first "true" clamshell PDA with an integrated camera. When it first came out I pretty much fell in love.

[Mastervtec]

The nx90 is the most innovative since it is the first pda with a "usable" camera, 2 mp verses 300,000 pixels on the nr70v, jsut my opinion tough.

[Rannous]

Easy - the Clie N710C. First Palm OS unit with what is becoming the new standard 320x320 screen resolution.

[JackAxe]

You mean the NZ90, right? =P

How is an upgrade of the NX70 which is an upgrade of the NR70 innovative?

Dammit I can't fin the link, but the NR60 looks exactly like a Pocket PC that came out before it.

Blah,
<]=)

[Sideway]

I'll have to agree with N710. HiRes screen and MP3 player with a PDA!

[Shogmaster]

Originally posted by Sideway
I'll have to agree with N710. HiRes screen and MP3 player with a PDA!

Yep! The reason I switched from being a Palm user of many many years.

I actually told people NOT to get the Sony Palm devices when they were B and W. "Why go to another manufacturer for the same OS when you have to take the penalty hit of using their expensive and proprietary memory stick?" I said.

But when the N710 came out and had 320x320 color screen and the MP3 player built in, it was no contest. I was like: Rape me with them memory sticks cause I'ma goin' Sony! This was right after I was burned with Sony's crappy @$$ LX900 Pen Tablet VAIO desktop too, but that didn't matter cause I got a replacemnt plan on the N710 anyways. :)

And this is the very reason why Sony better not become complacent with offering the same crap as Palm in prettier clothing (TG50). If they want more converts, they have to offer what they don't have, like HiRes+.

[Mastervtec]

Originally posted by JackAxe
You mean the NZ90, right? =P
<]=)

Yep, I meant the nz90, sorry hit the wrong key, fitting a 2mp camera in that small of a device is highly innovative, a 300,000mp camera is useless and not hard to fit in a small device, so I wouldn't call it just an upgrade.

[rhart00]

I have to agree about the N7xx clies. Very innovative. it had practically all the multimedia features of the nicest PPCs of the time plus it had a better screen!

philips has a 2mp camera the size of your thumb that they displayed at CES. Tiny multimegapixel cameras are becoming more common these days. I'd have to say the camera on the NZ isn't really that much more "usable" than the camera on the NX because it still doesn't have an optical zoom lens.

[Importluva]

I think that it would be a tossup between a NR70v and the n710c. Why? Well, the N710c for many reasons already stated. But the NR had the clamshell, keyboard, HiRes+, and the camera all in one package. I think that the n710 was the beginning innovator, and the NR was the newer innovation.

[AnthonyM]

Inovations come in phases.

The N710 because of the Hires color screen and MP3 player.

The NR70 because of the 320x480 screen, camera, onboard keyboard and clamshell design.

The NZ90 because of its all inclusiveness in a comparatively small package for what your getting.

The TG50 for its backlit keyboard.

All of these have broken new ground and I am sure Sony will continue to break new ground. If you have to choose which one had the most impact on the industry, it would have to be the NR70. That model has driven change throughout the Palm platform industry. From the people that write the applications for the Palm platform all the way to the other hardware manufacturers, nothing has driven change and has had a bigger impact on the Palm industry more than the NR70.

- Anthony

[mashoutposse]

The N710C is definitely innovative, but the NR70V introduced things that we have NEVER seen from any other PDA before it. The N710C is a natural progression, while the NR70V pretty much came out of nowhere.

Where were you when you first saw these pics? :D

http://www.pdabuzz.com/images/clie_prototype_01.jpg

http://www.pdabuzz.com/images/clie_prototype_02.jpg

[Jeffry]

Originally posted by mashoutposse
The N710C is definitely innovative, but the NR70V introduced things that we have NEVER seen from any other PDA before it. The N710C is a natural progression, while the NR70V pretty much came out of nowhere.

Where were you when you first saw these pics? :D

http://www.pdabuzz.com/images/clie_prototype_01.jpg

http://www.pdabuzz.com/images/clie_prototype_02.jpg

When Sony introduced that prototype I wasn't interested in PDAs. After I saw the NR at a local store priced at $699 USD I thought that the gadget was my dream device :) I fell in love.

[rldunn]

The only 2 real innovative Clies were the N710 and the NR70V, IMO. And boy were they innovative!! The N710 doesn't sound like much now and it was only 2 years ago, but MP3 and high-res were amazing to think about in a handheld. And even today, I remember how everyone, including myself, thought the NR70V sounded like a concept device, one of those "but they would never release that today" kind of reactions. And then they did and you just couldn't believe how many things it had in it. All the other Clies are just progressions from those two models.

[Importluva]

Definitely agree wit rldunn.

[Mastervtec]

Originally posted by rhart00
philips has a 2mp camera the size of your thumb that they displayed at CES. Tiny multimegapixel cameras are becoming more common these days. I'd have to say the camera on the NZ isn't really that much more "usable" than the camera on the NX because it still doesn't have an optical zoom lens.

I was at CES and that camera was a concept that they don't even know when it will come out, besides that it will be well over what many could afford. The 2mp camera is much more usable than 3000,000 mp, so what if it has no optical, you get great picture quality!! I find myself never even using the zoom on my digital, the zoom feature on all these digital cameras is useless, it doesn't get you "that much closer." Just my thoughts, I know everyone will disagree to the end that the nz90 was not THAT innovtive, but I find it to be the most highly innovative, the nr70 was innovative, but I think the features of the nz90 out way its innovativeness. IMO

[Importluva]

Originally posted by Mastervtec


I was at CES and that camera was a concept that they don't even know when it will come out, besides that it will be well over what many could afford. The 2mp camera is much more usable than 3000,000 mp, so what if it has no optical, you get great picture quality!! I find myself never even using the zoom on my digital, the zoom feature on all these digital cameras is useless, it doesn't get you "that much closer." Just my thoughts, I know everyone will disagree to the end that the nz90 was not THAT innovtive, but I find it to be the most highly innovative, the nr70 was innovative, but I think the features of the nz90 out way its innovativeness. IMO
I am going to have to repectfully DISAGREE with your stance. The NZ90 was more or less an evolution of a prior product, the NX, which was an evolution of the NR. A similar (actually VERY similar) PDA existed before teh NZ came out-the NX. There was nothing that was COMPLETELY different about the NZ. The NR on the other hand was completely different than basically any other PDA out there. The NZ was an evolutionary product, not an innovative one.

[Mastervtec]

Like I said, most of you will probably disagree with me to the end on this, but I still stand with my opinion. The camera was COMPLETELY DIFFERENT on both models, again 300,000 mp, verses 2 MILLION mp, come on, that is way different!! Any who, I still think the nz90 is innovative:

adj 1: ahead of the times; "the advanced teaching methods";

[rldunn]

You're right, we disagree with you :) In my book, the same feature, but better, is not innovative. Not that it's not nice or much better or whatever, but that doesn't make it innovative.

[jedix]

Originally posted by rldunn
The only 2 real innovative Clies were the N710 and the NR70V, IMO. And boy were they innovative!! The N710 doesn't sound like much now and it was only 2 years ago, but MP3 and high-res were amazing to think about in a handheld. And even today, I remember how everyone, including myself, thought the NR70V sounded like a concept device, one of those "but they would never release that today" kind of reactions. And then they did and you just couldn't believe how many things it had in it. All the other Clies are just progressions from those two models.

That's exactly what I was thinking! Those two models were the innovations! I hope to see more innovation from sony soon, not just improvements. (Don't get me wrong, I love my nz90!) Isn't technology great?:)

[Jake K]

Originally posted by Mastervtec
...The camera was COMPLETELY DIFFERENT on both models, again 300,000 mp, verses 2 MILLION mp...

Wouldn't a 300,000 mp camera be something like 300000000000 pixels?

[yOyOYoo]

how much more innovative can we get? you gotta wonder...

[yOyOYoo]

by we I mean sony haha

[Mastervtec]

Originally posted by Jake K


Wouldn't a 300,000 mp camera be something like 300000000000 pixels?

Probably, I should have put 300,000 pixels instead of 300,000 mp

[sindu]

Mastervtec, I am on your side. The NZ with built in BT and card reader is a far more potent.

[jedix]

Originally posted by Jake K


Wouldn't a 300,000 mp camera be something like 300000000000 pixels?

And wouldn't 2 million mp be like alot more zeroes after the 2? I think he just meant 2 mp. A two million megapixal camera would cost several million dollars!:D

[Importluva]

Yea, the NZ is cool and all, but it was the evolution of teh NX. Why can't people understand this? Its like saying that ivtec was a huge innovation-when rather regular vtec was the true innovation. iVtec was just more or less an upgrade to the system :)

[sindu]

Yes...the true innovation is on the N series...that is why NZ bear the "N" label. Nevertheless, NZ is also another important innovation in PDA world.

[JackAxe]

The NZ does have a built-in flash, that could be considered innovative for a PDA, first one that I know of.

<]=)

[jedix]

Well, I guess this whole concept depends on your definition of "innovative."

[Mastervtec]

Finally a few people see my point! And hey, lets get off my little screw-up of the whole megapixel thing, Sorry I got a bit messed up!

[AnthonyM]

I have to agree with the crowd that thinks the NZ is innovative. Not for the camera (it really is just an improvement). Not for the onboard keyboard (the NR had it first). Not for the design of the case or the larger screen (once again...NR). It is innovative because of the inclusion of a flash for the camera and in my opinion more importantly because it is the first PDA to shoehorn everything it has to offer into a PDA format. I know that there are those that think it is too large but I can't help but think that when you take stock in everything Sony has put into the NZ, you have to be impressed that they got it down to the size that it is.

I don't feel that the NZ is Sony's most innovative but I do feel that in its own right, it is innovative. In my opinion the NR is Sony's most innovative PDA too date.

- Anthony

[rob_squared]

Actually, isn't the defininiton of "innovation" simply the betterment of an existing product? Though the NZ is technically innovative, I don't think its the _most_ innovative.

[Importluva]

Originally posted by AnthonyM
I have to agree with the crowd that thinks the NZ is innovative. Not for the camera (it really is just an improvement). Not for the onboard keyboard (the NR had it first). Not for the design of the case or the larger screen (once again...NR). It is innovative because of the inclusion of a flash for the camera and in my opinion more importantly because it is the first PDA to shoehorn everything it has to offer into a PDA format. I know that there are those that think it is too large but I can't help but think that when you take stock in everything Sony has put into the NZ, you have to be impressed that they got it down to the size that it is.

I don't feel that the NZ is Sony's most innovative but I do feel that in its own right, it is innovative. In my opinion the NR is Sony's most innovative PDA too date.

- Anthony

Well, not to beat this to death (not like it hasn't been already :P) but the NR and the NX put all of these features (sans the flash) in one package. I guess in a way the NZ is innovative as rob said, it is the first pda to integrate an actual camera and flash. However, I do not think that it is the most innovative, as it got its design from the NR series.

[acraniotes]

Hands down, the NR takes the prize. Sure, the subsequent "N*" releases both added to and improved the existing functionality, but they did so at the expense of form-factor, while closely following the path laid down originally by the NRs. The NX and NZ amount to "refinements", not innovations. That said, they are both impressive devices in their own right.

The NR was the first PDA I encountered since the original iPAQ that evoked true feelings of gadget lust in my heart - right away I knew I had to have it. The NX and NZ just didn't bring the same sense of awe to the table for me because I had already been there/done that with the NR. Sure, they're faster and sport a newer OS, but the basic design remains the same. Personally, I won't bother upgrading my NR until the next "must-have" device comes out (which will probably be the long-awaited OS5/hires+/Bluetooth-enabled/tablet PDA - perhaps sporting a camera, I hope - that we're all anxiously waiting for Sony to announce).

-Adam

PS - Yes, the N-series gets a nod here, too. But ultimately, all it was doing was closing the functionality gap a bit between existing PPCs and PalmOS devices. The NR blew the lid off the PDA world with a whole slew of "firsts" - the camera, the swivelscreen, hires+, magnesium casing, enhanced IR, and the keyboard.

[Spiral]

The NZ shouldn't really be the most innovative, because if you look at the design, it's very similar tot he NR. Bluetooth, that's in lots of others, Hi-res+ was alrdy done, hardware buttoms in tablet mode was new, but suggested elsewhere, and not a huge difference. Also, i doubt the NZ will have many devices based off of it (the camera is quite large, expensive compared to average handheld). The NR has the NX and the NZ built after it.

Overall, I say NR probably has the most innovations, but the N-series started a lot of innovations.

[Mastervtec]

Okay, I have changed my stance, I guess the nz is not the MOST innovative, the nr probably is, but I still give great props to the nz!! there, are we all happy now!!!

[SprSaiyan8]

the nx70 due to the first built in camera that lead to the NZ90 and maney more great unit

[Mastervtec]

nr70 was the first with built in camera

[jedix]

Originally posted by Mastervtec
Okay, I have changed my stance, I guess the nz is not the MOST innovative, the nr probably is, but I still give great props to the nz!! there, are we all happy now!!!
:D jk
Even if its not innovative, the nz is still great!

[Importluva]

i lub nz

[Mastervtec]

Lets say somewhat innovative- i.e. built in flash. ;)

[mashoutposse]

I don't know about the rest of you, but my jaw dropped when I heard that the NZ would be packing a 2MP cam w/ flash. It may TECHNICALLY be evolutionary, but realistically, that's a HUGE jump, and should be considered an innovation in its own right.

[Mastervtec]

Agreed, but be ready for a whole lot of bashing from others, I tried saying that the nz90 was innovative and people jumped on my back over the whole thing. They say it is not innovative, but an improvement on previous models, which is somewhat correct. But I do say that a 2mp camera in such a small device is definitely innovative!!

[acraniotes]

Well, I think it just boils down to what someone's individual interpretation of "innovative" is in this particular instance. I took it to mean something along the lines of "trailblazing", in which case the NX and NZ clearly do not merit inclusion as they are following the lead established by the NR, not creating it. That said, I am by no means implying that the NR is superior to either device, as this most certainly is not the case. The NR was just here first, and it's design and feature set influenced the models that followed it.

Honestly, I don't think anyone here is disupting the assertion that the NZ's 2.0 megapixel camera is an impressive achievement in its own right. It's just not all that innovative seeing as how the camera-thing was done prior to the NZ's inception, albeit in a cruder fashion.

Remember, this thread's title is "Sony's MOST innovative PDA", not "How many Sony PDA's happen to contain a bit of innovation in their designs?"

-Adam

[jedix]

Originally posted by acraniotes
Well, I think it just boils down to what someone's individual interpretation of "innovative" is in this particular instance. I took it to mean something along the lines of "trailblazing", in which case the NX and NZ clearly do not merit inclusion as they are following the lead established by the NR, not creating it. That said, I am by no means implying that the NR is superior to either device, as this most certainly is not the case. The NR was just here first, and it's design and feature set influenced the models that followed it.

Honestly, I don't think anyone here is disupting the assertion that the NZ's 2.0 megapixel camera is an impressive achievement in its own right. It's just not all that innovative seeing as how the camera-thing was done prior to the NZ's inception, albeit in a cruder fashion.

Remember, this thread's title is "Sony's MOST innovative PDA", not "How many Sony PDA's happen to contain a bit of innovation in their designs?"

-Adam

Exactly! I couldn't have written it better myself!

[Vidge]

I am not very familiar with the N series, but as a long time Palm user (back to the original Pilot 5000), one look at the NR made me drool. So IMHO, is the NR!

[jedix]

Ah! The drool factor! One of my favorites!