Switched from NZ90 to NX-70V Due To Battery

[Redmond]

I hate to bring it up again but. . . .

Well, I did it. I thought I could live with the battery issue, but I couldn't, so I made the switch from the NZ-90 to the NX-70V.

CompUSA was nice enough to allow me to do the exchange without 1.) using my 1-time TAP (CUSA Warranty) 2.) they didn't charge me their 15% restocking fee and 3.) they credited back to my credit card $200 Buckaroos!!

I reported on this forum that I had battery issues after I read Brian's NZ-90 Review on bargainPDA.com. I was experiencing EXTREME Battery drainage and inaccurate Battery readings (yo-yo) effect. So I was looking for help, answers and similar experiences.

But Thanks to the help of some of the members (starstreak, mashoutposse and others) on this forum, I was content on keeping my NZ after I proved to myself I could rifle out 150 with mixed flash photos CONSECUTIVELY. I was happy and thought I could live with it.

But the battery problem (to me) was really still there. And it might be for all of you too. I was just pretending it was gone because I was able to rifle off 150 shots.

The problem I found was NOT in taking 150 shots one right after another. It will do that just fine. If I wanted to take 150 shots I'd whip out my 3.3MP digital still camera.

The battery problem manifested it self (to me) again. And that's when I decided "THAT'S IT!!!" That's not what a $700 PDA is supposed to do. So I started the NZ-90 Impeachment Process.

Try this on your NZ. It may or may not manifest on your NZ-90:

1. Charge the NX to 100% capacity - using the Charge LED indicator (4 hrs.) OR overnight (4+ hrs).

2. Turn on the NZ, verify that you're at 100%

3. Adjust screen brightness to whatever. The brighter the screen, the sooner the problem will probably manifest. It's relative to the screen brightness.

4. No WiFi or Bluetooth

5. Go into the Camera App. DO NOT force the Flash OFF. (It was in the evening when I did it and flash was required because of room lighting - so if you're doing this during the day - Force the flash ON)

6. Stay in the Camera App for a while - (say a SOLID 7-10 minutes) taking flash photos every 30 sec. or so. ( I was taking family photos and was composing shots, talking, chasing after my kids to cooperate) This to me is a very REAL WORLD expectation, not like rifling out 150 shots.

7. Pay attention to your Battery Power Meter in the Camera App. (mine started to drop at a rate of at least 10% in 5 mins.)

8. Exit the Camera App to the Main screen and check your Battery Level.

9. Repeat Step 5-8 one more time, twice if you want.

10. Your results will vary depending on your screen brightness and battery condition.

By the time I was done, I was at 35% BP. That’s a drain of 65% in 20 min?? TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE. Again, it got to the point where I couldn't take flash photos. If you can live with that, then the NZ's for you.

You don't have to wait for a 100% charge to try this.
You can try it right now if you want.
The important thing is to REMAIN in the Camera App for a while.

Remaining in the Camera App for 5-10 minutes to me is NOT impractical. It's REAL WORLD. It's par for the course.

The Battery will even go down right in front of your eyes even if you REMAIN in the Camera APP and DON'T take ANY pictures. Just POKING around in the Camera App.

If the Camera App draws so much power and leaves me with the inability of the use of the camera, say towards the end of the day (let alone in 30 minutes!), then the PDA is USELESS to me.

I think the problem will only manifest itself if you remain in the Camera App and not so much if you rifle out shots.

So, I charged my NZ to 100% last night, took it in to CompUSA this morning @100% charge and was able to duplicate EXZACTLY the battery drain problem to the PDA Specialist in 20 minutes.

I bought my sister a NX-70V and she's had NO problems.
So I traded down to the NX -70V, got back $200 and still a full 2year TAP (CUSA Warranty).

Too bad, I kinda liked the NZ. It was kinda big though. I actually like the NX form factor better anyway. But I liked the BLACK NZ case though.

I really think the NZ has a design flaw. If yours is OK, then I'M HAPPY FOR YOU. If it's NOT, I suggest you get your money back or get something that will work for you ASAP. Don't fool yourself. Don't hang on to it just for bragging rights. It's too expensive, unless $700 is no problem to you. Besides, in a few months Sony will have a newer REVISED/CORRECTED Nx out and you'll be stuck with the NZ.

I'll be around to answer a few questions.

After that I'll probably be hanging out in the NX Forum instead of the NZ forum.

I think Brian was right. Thanks Brian.

Good luck!!

;)

[reggae]

i'm an nx user... i have to say that the flash draining power is an obvious but what isn't so obvious to the lay user is that in the camera app we're running live video => processor intensive => battery drain. so the two coupled together makes for short life. i really like the nx70v but i was recently dissapointed with the nightshot i took the other evenening. oh well, the grass will remain greener... ;-)

[Redmond]

Thanks for the heads up reggae.

I'll know NOT to complain about green grass.

How does that go now? "the grass is greener on the NX side of the fence" ??

;)

[Mr. Thompson]

My wife and I both have NXs. I purchased my NZ when were first available at Circuit City. Yeah, it's not a high drain NiMH battery. So buy a spare and or buy a PEGA-BC10 (yes it works fine with the NZ.) While the NX is a great PDA, there is NO way I am going back to it. My NX is up for sale BTW...

[Redmond]

Thank you Mr. Thompson

I liked the NZ while I had it. I just couldn't swollow the high battery drain on the camera. For $700 bucks and the NZ's high drain battery, I think SONY should have INCLUDED an additional battery.

If the Camera function is a seldom used feature of the PDA then maybe the NZ will work for you.

An option here and ther will push you into over $1000 bucks and that's WAY TOO MUCH to pay for ANY PDA.

Good luck with you new NZ. I hope it works well for you.

;)

[Importluva]

Nice to know that you made this thread in an EXTREMELY civilized manner, not bashing on the NZ. I have an NX, and my battery gets really low at the end of the day. But thats from my constant MP3 playing, camera useage, and of course PIMs. I love my NX tho :D

[Marudine]

Redmond, I can understand the joy when you first get the nz on your hand, and now you have to part with it with great disappointment. Though I'm very interested in getting a nz soon, but also worry about the battery problem. Is kind of 'luck' .. some can get good battery power and not the others.

IMHO, a spare battery is good if you need to use the PDA on the road for prolong period w/o power charging facility. However, it should not be a case where u need to use it now and then due to high power drainage.

[Redmond]

Thanks Importluva.

I look forward to using my NX. It's in the cradle (sleeping) charging.

Actually, when I think about it, all I REALLY wanted from the SONY Palms is the Photo Icon of your Contact in the Contact Database.

In my case (hindsight), I'm actually glad I got the NX because it'll do the trick just fine.

;)

[Mr. Thompson]

Redmond - Agreed on the extra battery and I do understand your position. It's kind of Sony to give us a choice so we can both be happy.

[Redmond]

Originally posted by Marudine
Redmond, I can understand the joy when you first get the nz on your hand, and now you have to part with it with great disappointment. Though I'm very interested in getting a nz soon, but also worry about the battery problem. Is kind of 'luck' .. some can get good battery power and not the others.

IMHO, a spare battery is good if you need to use the PDA on the road for prolong period w/o power charging facility. However, it should not be a case where u need to use it now and then due to high power drainage.

I don't think it's luck. I truly believe it's a SONY design problem. Only if you use the camera in the manner in which I used it, which I think was not "pushing" it. It was perfectly NORMAL.

Again, for $700 bucks (that's the most expensive PDA ever I think and thats Palm or Pocket PC) I think SONY should include an extra battery or two for the benefit of its TRULY dedicated customers.

My suggestion: hold off. See if the NX might work for you. Maybe it will, maybe not. But be prepared to pay almost $1000 by the time you're done paying for an extra battery or two and a WiFi card.

Just my opinion.

;)

[pdagal]

Redmond, how did you get your NZ for $700 rather than $800 from CompUSA?

I can understand what you're saying. I have both the NX70V and the NZ90, but tend to take the NX with me since I can count on the camera and battery when out all day on business (no worries about keeping a charged spare battery on hand or manually prodding the flash and camera).
They are both very cool devices, and while the NZ wins on cool-factor, it is more high maintenance.

[Redmond]

Originally posted by pdagal
Redmond, how did you get your NZ for $700 rather than $800 from CompUSA?

I can understand what you're saying. I have both the NX70V and the NZ90, but tend to take the NX with me since I can count on the camera and battery when out all day on business (no worries about keeping a charged spare battery on hand or manually prodding the flash and camera).
They are both very cool devices, and while the NZ wins on cool-factor, it is more high maintenance.

Ya know what? You're right!! It was my guilt typing. I unconsiously was thinking $700 bucks. I TOTALLY forgot about the extra $99 Dollars.

I DID pay $799 plus TAX.

Thank you for the correction.

No doubt about it. BOTH PDA's are very COOL.

Thanks again for the correction. You made me feel BETTER.

;)

[Mr. Thompson]

Perhaps it would help readers of this thread to provide why I prefer the NZ. Even though I have a plethora of digital cameras, I don’t keep one with me all the time. There are precious moments I have captured with my NX that were lacking due to the camera limitations. The NZ rectifies this while doing a superb job at handling my PDA needs. In my daily use pattern, the battery is not a problem and the better camera is always there for those choice moments.

On a side note, I love the NZs display although I could certainly live with the NXs display.

[Redmond]

The subject of this thread is: Switched from NZ90 to NX-70V Due To Battery

I just wanted to share the reason why I switched.

I think there might be other thread that point out the features of the NZ-90.

But you're welcome to share.

;)

[Mr. Thompson]

Redmond – I can read, and do understand the subject of this thread. While I can also understand your frustrations with the NZ, I don’t understand the condescending tone of your last post, even with the wink. My additional comments were intended to benefit the reader.

For the reader, the NZ is a great PDA with a half way decent digital camera, suitable for occasional use (without extra batteries), while the NX is a great PDA with a very limited camera. If you want to take lots of marginal photos with a PDA, buy a NX. If you want a half way decent camera built into your PDA, buy the NZ and deal with the battery issue. I sincerely hope this puts things in perspective.

[Redmond]

Originally posted by Mr. Thompson
Redmond – I can read, and do understand the subject of this thread. While I can also understand your frustrations with the NZ, I don’t understand the condescending tone of your last post, even with the wink. My additional comments were intended to benefit the reader.

For the reader, the NZ is a great PDA with a half way decent digital camera, suitable for occasional use (without extra batteries), while the NX is a great PDA with a very limited camera. If you want to take lots of marginal photos with a PDA, buy a NX. If you want a half way decent camera built into your PDA, buy the NZ and deal with the battery issue. I sincerely hope this puts things in perspective.

Please accept my sincere apology Mr. Thompson.

I did not mean to be condescending.

Your views are very much appreciated.

;)

[Importluva]

I honestly think that the Camera on teh NZ is awesome. I'm a college student and most of us are heavy users of computers and the internet. So, all you really need is a 2 mp camera to get a good shot, and then resize it to like 800x600 or so to get it to fit in a window w/o scrolling. The camera on the NZ is perfect for this, as most of us with a pda will always have it on us. However, how many college students can afford the $800 beast...not many I'm sure ;)

[starstreak]

Well I'm at work. I took 2 shots withOUT flash. I've been turning it off/on just to check the battery and maybe the calc for a total of 30minutes. I'm down to 70%. So technicly I used this without the camera feature and I'm killing the unit without really using it. Granted its 70%. But I hardly used the unit.
Oh and he's right if I turn on the camera app for 30 seconds, I dropped to 35% took no shots. Turned it off and just waited 2 minutes. Battery is now at 67% and not going up. 3% loss for just having the app on for 30 seconds. It has to be a batch that sony sent out. All my replacments are coming from this same batch.

[dimensiondvdrob]

I have an NZ and the battery doesn't affect me at all, I barely even notice that it could be worse than my NX was. All I know is with the NX, I didn't really ever think of taking photos with it, due to the fact that most times I wanted to use it, I was in a situation where it needed a flash. Now, with the NZ, I can take my PDA to a birthday dinner with friends and shoot off pics without worrying whether they'll come out good later. Most of my PDA usage is at the office or from client to client, so I am always in reach of the cradle for charging. I think if I go on a trip where I would need the extra strength, I would buy the battery adapter or AC adapter to charge on the road. Over all, I love my NZ and would not trade it for anything right now.

[birick]

Thank you Redmond. I have been swaying back and forth on upgrading from NX to NZ. After reading many post on the subject of battery life, that was my biggest concern. Mr. Thompson also pointed out the camera is halfway decent. So, I'm staying with my NX, not ready to spend extra money for a halfway decent camera that eats batteries. Thanks again for the informative post.

[Redmond]

Originally posted by Importluva
I honestly think that the Camera on teh NZ is awesome. I'm a college student and most of us are heavy users of computers and the internet. So, all you really need is a 2 mp camera to get a good shot, and then resize it to like 800x600 or so to get it to fit in a window w/o scrolling. The camera on the NZ is perfect for this, as most of us with a pda will always have it on us. However, how many college students can afford the $800 beast...not many I'm sure ;)

I thought the pictures were decient for a basic 2MP camera.

I have a 2MP Olympus C2100UZ that takes awsome shots, but like you said, I dont have it with me all the time, and the NZ might be with me all the time. So its good for those situations where you dont have your camera with you.

And again, at $800 Bucks, yup, you're probably right, not too many college students can afford it is right.

Thanks for your input.

;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by starstreak
Well I'm at work. I took 2 shots withOUT flash. I've been turning it off/on just to check the battery and maybe the calc for a total of 30minutes. I'm down to 70%. So technicly I used this without the camera feature and I'm killing the unit without really using it. Granted its 70%. But I hardly used the unit.
Oh and he's right if I turn on the camera app for 30 seconds, I dropped to 35% took no shots. Turned it off and just waited 2 minutes. Battery is now at 67% and not going up. 3% loss for just having the app on for 30 seconds. It has to be a batch that sony sent out. All my replacments are coming from this same batch.

starstreak, thanks for validating what I said earlier.

You're at work?? At this hour?? What do you do?

Best of luck to you!

;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by birick
Thank you Redmond. I have been swaying back and forth on upgrading from NX to NZ. After reading many post on the subject of battery life, that was my biggest concern. Mr. Thompson also pointed out the camera is halfway decent. So, I'm staying with my NX, not ready to spend extra money for a halfway decent camera that eats batteries. Thanks again for the informative post.

It was a pleasure. I figure I got help from this board, I might as well contribute what I learned.

I think in my hindsight case, the NX will suit me just fine.

Goody, now I can justify buying some other toy with the money I saved!!

In your case, I think your NX will do the job just fine. I'd get a 128MB MS in case you dont already have one.

;)

[birick]

I've got a couple of 128s, and I'm already happy with my NX. My problem is I keep thinking I need the latest model, but the reality is that I can't keep up with Sony. I can now say that I positively will not buy the NZ.

P.S. When is the next Clie due out? :D

[Redmond]

BTW, for those interested, I also have a 2.0Mhz IBM ThinkPad T30 Notebook with WiFi and Bluetooth also.

I had some problems Blueing between the Notebook and NZ.

I didn't get in to it much, but what I was attempting to do was to get the NZ Bluetoothed with the IBM to get on the internet using the provided Browser software.

As I said, I didn't spend too much time on it though.

Just FYI though. . . .



;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by birick
I've got a couple of 128s, and I'm already happy with my NX. My problem is I keep thinking I need the latest model, but the reality is that I can't keep up with Sony. I can now say that I positively will not buy the NZ.

P.S. When is the next Clie due out? :D

Then you're set!!

Ya know what? I've been there, done that. And I can't keep up. Spent lots of $$$. Time for me to take it easy.

Like you, I think the NX will do just fine for now.

Dunno when the next Clie is due, but I remember reading somewhere that SONY is committed to release an UN-GODLY number new models of Clies each year!! I was thinkin' 90???

I might be WAY WAY of base though. Don't quote me.

:)

[davy19]

Here is your problem:

3. Adjust screen brightness to whatever. The brighter the screen, the sooner the problem will probably manifest. It's relative to the screen


This is pretty obvious, and dont understand how that is an issue?


What do you keep your brightness on?

I keep mine all the way down, dont need it all with this unit. Maybe that is why i can get so many pics and hardly see any drain.


Speaking of which it is now thursday have not charged my unit since Sunday, and only down to 60% on battery.


Also that is why they sell spare batteries if you need it. I acutally think the battery is better on my NZ90 then NX ever was. I could never go this long without having to charge it.



btw I alaso have an olympus 2100 UZ, and think the camera rocks, and love it. Best camera I ever had for 2 mp, but knowing the size of it, I hardly ever bring it with me, unless I know I will use it for a specific reason, with the NZ90 never have to worry about it.

[mace2k]

I'm getting the same resulsts as davy19. I charged my NZ on Monday, and it's only down to 80%. That being said, I'm traveling with it and have been using it off and on in conjunction with my laptop...maybe for 5-10 minutes at a time. I have taken a couple of flash photos of wiring closets as well.

Maybe I just got a good one? I also purchased (2) spare batteries (okay...my company actually purchased them), but have yet to use them.

This being said, I still have my NX sitting at my desk. I personally did not see battery life as good as this on my NX. And the addition of the flash is what sold me (kinda dark in some wiring closets).

I did not do any of the "draining and charging" that others have discussed to condition the battery either.

I must have just been lucky with mine, and I'm truly sorry that everyone else isn't having the same luck with their battery. Like I said, I've still got my NX...but it looks like I'll be handing it over to one of my employees soon.

And thanks for your comments Redmond. It does sound like you will be happier with the NX since you got stuck with an NZ that was experiencing these battery problems. I got my NZ at PcConnection...wonder if that makes any difference???

[Redmond]

Originally posted by davy19
Here is your problem:

This is pretty obvious, and dont understand how that is an issue?

What do you keep your brightness on?

Speaking of which it is now thursday have not charged my unit since Sunday, and only down to 60% on battery.

Also that is why they sell spare batteries if you need it. I acutally think the battery is better on my NZ90 then NX ever was. I could never go this long without having to charge it.

btw I alaso have an olympus 2100 UZ, and think the camera rocks, and love it. Best camera I ever had for 2 mp, but knowing the size of it, I hardly ever bring it with me, unless I know I will use it for a specific reason, with the NZ90 never have to worry about it.

Actually davy19, I had my Brightness at the LOWEST setting.

But You're right about the Brightness. That's why I said "3. Adjust screen brightness to whatever. The brighter the screen, the sooner the problem will probably manifest. It's relative to the screen brightness. "

Like you, I noticed that the Battery drain was very insignificant from day to day. But again, it depends on your usage.

I still contend that if you spend even a few minutes in the Camera App, the camera drain will be extremely disproportional to the rest of the PDA functions and you better have your spare battery on hand.

For me, my expectations of the NZ Battery was higher. My SONY DV camcorder starter battery doesn't do much better, that's why I bought a larger battery, but even with a larger battery, it was less expensive than my NZ-90. I also started to freak out when I was thinking how much I was having to spend on the NZ. KA CHING $$$$ My limits on any PDA is less than the four digit mark.

We can both smile about our Oly C2100UZ can't we? IT ROCKS. I would almost say I'd put it up against any 3-5MP 3X Zoom digital camera because the 2100's 10X Zoom. Any way, I'm waiting for a high MP camera with atleast 10X Zoom to replace my 2100. I think the Nikon 5700 comes in very close. But I'm gonna wait.

Thanks for your observations. They;re all very valid and to the point.

;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by mace2k
I'm getting the same resulsts as davy19. I charged my NZ on Monday, and it's only down to 80%. That being said, I'm traveling with it and have been using it off and on in conjunction with my laptop...maybe for 5-10 minutes at a time. I have taken a couple of flash photos of wiring closets as well.

Maybe I just got a good one? I also purchased (2) spare batteries (okay...my company actually purchased them), but have yet to use them.

This being said, I still have my NX sitting at my desk. I personally did not see battery life as good as this on my NX. And the addition of the flash is what sold me (kinda dark in some wiring closets).

I did not do any of the "draining and charging" that others have discussed to condition the battery either.

I must have just been lucky with mine, and I'm truly sorry that everyone else isn't having the same luck with their battery. Like I said, I've still got my NX...but it looks like I'll be handing it over to one of my employees soon.

And thanks for your comments Redmond. It does sound like you will be happier with the NX since you got stuck with an NZ that was experiencing these battery problems. I got my NZ at PcConnection...wonder if that makes any difference???

I'm happy for you if your Battery performance is up to your expectations. And like you said, it will depend on your usage. But you also said you had $pare Batterie$$.

That was an available option for me too, but I was not willing to go there.

I'm in the Insurance business. I meet with clients as late as 8-10PM sometines. My IBM ThinkPad T30 has the main Battery and the extended Battery in the UltraBay and cost me $2000. I just didn't want my PDA approaching an entry level Notebook price.

All I wanted in a PDA is to put Names to Faces and keep my Schedule. Names to Faces is something that SONY does really well with the ability to take a snapshot of a person and put it on the Contact Database.

So the built-in camera function on the N60, 70 and 90 works well for that. So I initally bought the "top of the line" NZ-90 for the job, but I also had higher expectations. For me, it didn't live up to it, so off the the 70 I go.

Now I may experience the same issues on the N70 so I'll be sure to keep the camera usage to a quick snapshot of client and Thank You. I will make the 70 work for me and at this point think it will.

Thanks for your comments though,

;)

[oneeyesquare]

Sour grapes... The NZ has more battery depth than the NX. I could barely use the WiFi card for more than an hour with the NX. I can get a solid 2.5 and usually throw it back in the charger at 3 hours at 30% remaining on the NZ. The camera seems to be a battery hog, but your powering a huge dispaly screen along with it as well. When was the last time you saw a 2mp camera with a display this size. Most have a little dinky screen you can barely read... Even if you get the flash disable screen, it's easily overridden by tapping the flash icon back on and if you find you need more battery, buy an extra!!! Try that with the NX....
I haven't had any battery related problems that are any different than my experience with the NX. I even take a few more pics now that I have flash and they are absolutely stunning in comparision with the NX. A quick autofix with PaintShopPro yields a picture even better than those coming out of my wife's DSCP-51. All this in a unit that I HAVE with me 24/7. The NX still went in the cradle every night and so does the NZ.... But for my money I'll take the better camera and brighter screen....
I'm posting cuz there seems to be a rash of detractors lately. For those reading still attempting to decide, some of us are having a ball with this new unit and are too busy to write the glowing reports it deserves. It's an AWESOME PDA. Even my wife was impressed by it and she considered my NX a toy....

[n2ifp]

Wada mean no hams???? :(

[keesercc]

Something I was wondering. Has anyone talked about the incredibly LONG delay for the camera to start up? Or is that just a problem that the unit I used seemed to have. Go to take a picture, wait for 30 seconds, oh wait, I'd rather take a movie, wait another 30 seconds. Sorry. whats that good for? certainly not QUICK photos. again, was this only happening in the particular model I was using? has anyone else noticed this as well? I think that it should be mentioned if it is not an isolated case.

[the_iceman]

Redmond,

I understand your frustrations. I did some of my own testing and found fairly good results.

I did start with a fully charged handheld and performed a test taking a group of 4 pictures 4 times. I would view this as 'typical' of a person taking pictures. When one goes to the zoo they don't normally take 20-30 pictures of a zebra or monkey at any one point in time. They take a couple pictures and move on. I did this several times, each time exiting the Camera application.

I first tried some of the recommendations from this site... to see about getting more 'time' from my camera/battery. I let it charge up to 100% and then clicked 1600x1200, 800x600, 640x480 pictures with flash (using redeye reduction and high flash) and some without flash (a very wide variety of pictures). I did this for 2-3 charge cycles just to see if it would help extend the life/smartness of the battery. I did get to a point... of being able to 'rifle' off 212 pictures with various resolutions...using High-Flash & Redeye reduction on my Memory Stick before the cam is rendered useless based on charge amount left in the Battery. Like you said... who wants to just rifle off 200+ pics in short order?

Anyway.....After the last charge... I went and took some pictures. I took 4 pictures at a time during a 2 minute time frame. That is about 1 picture every 30 seconds. Once the 4th picture had written to the Memory Stick(MS) I exited the Camera Software and went back to the Palm Launcher. I then waited 3 minutes between each test to try and ensure the Camera Capacitor had discharged fully back to the battery. (Note: During the testing, all pictures were taken at 1600x1200, high flash, no redeye)

After the 1st set of 4 pictures, the Battery life came back to 98%
After the 2nd set of 4 pictures the Battery life came back to 96%
After the 3rd set of 4 pictures the Battery life came back to 93%
After the 4th set of 4 pictures the Battery life came back at 90%.

I guess my viewpoint..... is that I don't expect my CLIE to replace a real/digital camera for all uses. I look at it as something 'fun' to have baked into the PDA itself. Maybe... if one is at a party... to get 20-30 pictures..... or anything 'on the fly'.

I agree... that if one wants to use the camera... as a replacement camera for a digital one or real SLR.. and want the ability to take lots of pictures... then a second battery would be wise to buy.

I do think, once the initial month or two has passed after purchasing the NZ90.... most people will trim down their picture taking. But that is just my view point on it all.

Have a great day everyone!

[pdagal]

I stopwatched it at just under nine seconds consistently. Other reviewers and users have noted about the same. It may feel like 30 seconds when you're in a hurry or accidentally launch the camera app ;) If yours really is taking that long, then there's definitely something wrong with your unit.

Originally posted by keesercc
Something I was wondering. Has anyone talked about the incredibly LONG delay for the camera to start up? Or is that just a problem that the unit I used seemed to have. Go to take a picture, wait for 30 seconds, oh wait, I'd rather take a movie, wait another 30 seconds. Sorry. whats that good for? certainly not QUICK photos. again, was this only happening in the particular model I was using? has anyone else noticed this as well? I think that it should be mentioned if it is not an isolated case.

[Clietivity]

Originally posted by birick
Thank you Redmond. I have been swaying back and forth on upgrading from NX to NZ. After reading many post on the subject of battery life, that was my biggest concern. Mr. Thompson also pointed out the camera is halfway decent. So, I'm staying with my NX, not ready to spend extra money for a halfway decent camera that eats batteries. Thanks again for the informative post.


My advise to anyone who are looking forward to buy a NZ to hold off a while. It is obvious that NZ90 has some problems with its Info Lithium battery or its power management design.

Besides, such a powerful mulitmedia PDA like NZ90 really deserve more memory than the current 11MB (usable). I'll say it needs at least a 32MB. IMHO, NZ90's design still need some major polishing.

Looking at the rate of Sony pushing out new PDA to the market, a new and improved 32MB NZ should be out very soon (remember what happened to NR and NX?) So be patient or pay the price and sacrifice.

:rolleyes:

[Clietivity]

Originally posted by keesercc
Something I was wondering. Has anyone talked about the incredibly LONG delay for the camera to start up? Or is that just a problem that the unit I used seemed to have. Go to take a picture, wait for 30 seconds, oh wait, I'd rather take a movie, wait another 30 seconds. Sorry. whats that good for? certainly not QUICK photos. again, was this only happening in the particular model I was using? has anyone else noticed this as well? I think that it should be mentioned if it is not an isolated case.

Maybe it needs sometime to charge up the flash?!:D

[keesercc]

Ok, nine seconds. But still, when compared to an nx70v, thats is a LONG time. =)

[dimensiondvdrob]

Yeah, compared to an NX it is long, but you need to realize that you have a REAL camera built into the NZ, not a novelty camera app. My DSC-P1 takes 5 seconds or so to turn on and be ready for action, so I think I can wait 4 more seconds for my PDA to warm up for a shot. Like it was stated earlier in this forum (i think) this is a PDA with a camera attached, not a camera with a PDA attached.

[Unregistered]

My Fuji and HP (3 to 4 MP) digicams take about 1 second to boot. The cameras I had a few years ago took longer, but newer ones are pretty fast.

[dimensiondvdrob]

my DSC is older, prolly like 2-3 years old. Maybe that's why it takes longer.

[Redmond]

Originally posted by oneeyesquare
Sour grapes... The NZ has more battery depth than the NX. I could barely use the WiFi card for more than an hour with the NX. I can get a solid 2.5 and usually throw it back in the charger at 3 hours at 30% remaining on the NZ. The camera seems to be a battery hog, but your powering a huge dispaly screen along with it as well. When was the last time you saw a 2mp camera with a display this size. Most have a little dinky screen you can barely read... Even if you get the flash disable screen, it's easily overridden by tapping the flash icon back on and if you find you need more battery, buy an extra!!! Try that with the NX....
I haven't had any battery related problems that are any different than my experience with the NX. I even take a few more pics now that I have flash and they are absolutely stunning in comparision with the NX. A quick autofix with PaintShopPro yields a picture even better than those coming out of my wife's DSCP-51. All this in a unit that I HAVE with me 24/7. The NX still went in the cradle every night and so does the NZ.... But for my money I'll take the better camera and brighter screen....
I'm posting cuz there seems to be a rash of detractors lately. For those reading still attempting to decide, some of us are having a ball with this new unit and are too busy to write the glowing reports it deserves. It's an AWESOME PDA. Even my wife was impressed by it and she considered my NX a toy....

oneeyesquare, point taken. You're pobably right. The NZ has more Battery depth than the NX.

And now since I've decided to go to the NX, I'll have to deal with what ever I encounter with the NX. I think the NX's camera is just a little more battery friendly.

I'm happy you haven't had any battery problems.

Its just for me, I did the math:
$799.00 for the NZ-90
$149.00 for the WiFi
$ 80.00 for an extra battery
$ 99.00 CompUSA Warranty
$ 60.00 for a 128MB MS
$1187 TOTAL BEFORE TAX!!! (8.8% in WA = $1291)

That kinda of money is too much for me to spend on any PDA.

Of course, I initially bought a NZ-90 but I bought because of my WANTS and EMOTION. After I took it back and got my $200 Bucks back I felt better.

As far as I'm concerned, they're BOTH TOYS. It's not that the NX is a toy and the NX isn't. The NX just cost more.

I Hope the NX will serve me fine.

;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by keesercc
Something I was wondering. Has anyone talked about the incredibly LONG delay for the camera to start up? Or is that just a problem that the unit I used seemed to have. Go to take a picture, wait for 30 seconds, oh wait, I'd rather take a movie, wait another 30 seconds. Sorry. whats that good for? certainly not QUICK photos. again, was this only happening in the particular model I was using? has anyone else noticed this as well? I think that it should be mentioned if it is not an isolated case.

keesercc, I noticed that too.

I'm not an expert, but I surmise that the lag is due to maybe the Flash charging up. Which is a large drain on the battery.

Perhaps if you turn the flash off immediately upon entering the Camera App, it might be a tad bit more responsive.

;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by the_iceman
Redmond,

I understand your frustrations. I did some of my own testing and found fairly good results.


After the 1st set of 4 pictures, the Battery life came back to 98%
After the 2nd set of 4 pictures the Battery life came back to 96%
After the 3rd set of 4 pictures the Battery life came back to 93%
After the 4th set of 4 pictures the Battery life came back at 90%.


the_iceman, absolutely! Like I said your tests will vary and will also depend on your usage like you said.

Again, my expectation of a $800 PDA I think is not outragious.

All I really want is a PDA for scheduleing and Contacts wit Photos of my Contacts.

I bought the NZ because I wanted the Caddilac. I bought because of EMOTION. And the EMOTION will many times steer you wrong.

But thank you for the positive Battery reports. I'm sure many others are curious what a good battery report on the NZ might be like.


;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by Clietivity

My advise to anyone who are looking forward to buy a NZ to hold off a while. It is obvious that NZ90 has some problems with its Info Lithium battery or its power management design.

Besides, such a powerful mulitmedia PDA like NZ90 really deserve more memory than the current 11MB (usable). I'll say it needs at least a 32MB. IMHO, NZ90's design still need some major polishing.

Looking at the rate of Sony pushing out new PDA to the market, a new and improved 32MB NZ should be out very soon (remember what happened to NR and NX?) So be patient or pay the price and sacrifice.

:rolleyes:

Clietivity, HEAR HEAR!!

I TOTALLY AGREE!!!

;)

[voltz]

Redmond, I have to agree with you on the power/camera issue. The primary reason why I bought the NZ was to have an available 2mb camera, because I'm not in the habit of lugging around my larger digital camera. The keyword for me was "available". But after owning it for 2 weeks, I can see that the vast majority of the time (the times when my NZ is NOT showing over 70% battery power available), I do not have enough power to start the camera application. IOW, the camera is NOT available for me. So if I want to use the Clie camera, I have to plan to use it by having my Clie fully charged...but if I have time to plan ahead for the times where I need the camera, I might as well bring my Canon!

But, I will choose to keep my NZ because of all the other great things it does...and I have no use for the marginal photos put out by the NX.

Just my thoughts...

[starstreak]

I consider the camera as a bonus feature. Not soemthing to replace my digital camera. But if I'm not using the camera or just taking like 2-5 shots a day, I would exspect a battery life greater than 1-2 day. Read the topic: My thrid unit- is it the charm?

Sony sent me a letter  with some stuff to try to exstend battery life. All of which was talked about on the board which I did say I did do in the letter to Sony.
Sony is saying 15 days of use from one charge. I don't think so. Even in the original flyer for the NZ90, it states 12 days with no BT/wifi and NO backlight. That in itself kinda bogus.

[oneeyesquare]

Redmond, you're a (edit- changed my mind, troll at the least....)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by voltz
Redmond, I have to agree with you on the power/camera issue. The primary reason why I bought the NZ was to have an available 2mb camera, because I'm not in the habit of lugging around my larger digital camera. The keyword for me was "available". But after owning it for 2 weeks, I can see that the vast majority of the time (the times when my NZ is NOT showing over 70% battery power available), I do not have enough power to start the camera application. IOW, the camera is NOT available for me. So if I want to use the Clie camera, I have to plan to use it by having my Clie fully charged...but if I have time to plan ahead for the times where I need the camera, I might as well bring my Canon!

But, I will choose to keep my NZ because of all the other great things it does...and I have no use for the marginal photos put out by the NX.

Just my thoughts...

Voltz, I bought my NZ for the same exact reason, to have a 2MP camera with me at all times. Like I said in some of my earlier posts, I really like the SONY Address Book's ability to include a thumbnail photo of the Contact.

I bought the NZ (since it was the “top of the line”) hoping to get great Contact photos.

As it turns out, a 2MP photo for each Contact would require a huge amount of memory. So, I discovered all I really needed was a 320x240 thumbnail photo, which the NX will do just fine.

The NZ definitely has its merits though.

Live long and prosper.

Enjoy your NZ voltz.

;)

[Redmond]

Originally posted by starstreak
I consider the camera as a bonus feature. Not soemthing to replace my digital camera. But if I'm not using the camera or just taking like 2-5 shots a day, I would exspect a battery life greater than 1-2 day. Read the topic: My thrid unit- is it the charm?

Sony sent me a letter  with some stuff to try to exstend battery life. All of which was talked about on the board which I did say I did do in the letter to Sony.
Sony is saying 15 days of use from one charge. I don't think so. Even in the original flyer for the NZ90, it states 12 days with no BT/wifi and NO backlight. That in itself kinda bogus.

starstreak! welcome back!!

That kind of reminds me of the EPA Gas Mileage thing.

Your Mileage (Battery) will vary.

:)

[mashoutposse]

It sounds like money played a big role in your decision. Readers should consider that when reading this thread -- the NZ is for the "Functionality at all costs; money no object" crowd, and I think that it caters to that demographic perfectly. There are lots of people who are not completely satisfied with today's technology, and are willing to pay for a device that takes things to another level. If you asked me when a PDA would have a 2MP cam w/ flash, I would have guessed the end of 2004 - yet it's already here.

The NX is still an excellent, excellent PDA. That's as good a secondary choice as you can make.

[Redmond]

Originally posted by mashoutposse
It sounds like money played a big role in your decision. Readers should consider that when reading this thread -- the NZ is for the "Functionality at all costs; money no object" crowd, and I think that it caters to that demographic perfectly. There are lots of people who are not completely satisfied with today's technology, and are willing to pay for a device that takes things to another level. If you asked me when a PDA would have a 2MP cam w/ flash, I would have guessed the end of 2004 - yet it's already here.

The NX is still an excellent, excellent PDA. That's as good a secondary choice as you can make.

Mashoutposse actually for me, functionality came first. When the NZ didn’t work for me the way I expected it to, I began to feel “what did I pay all this money for”?

When I got around to thinking about it, my NZ purchase cost more than my DV or my digital camera with all it’s extra batteries.

So my Return On Investment was not starting to look good. I analyzed my options and for my purposes, the NX serves me just fine.

BTW, a thought just occurred to me, how would one go about charging the “extra NZ” battery? Do you have to buy an external charger? Or do you have to charge the extra in the NZ and then charge the primary in there as well? So does that mean 8 hours of charging?

When I started this thread, I was just wanting to share my reasons. Functionally as well as monetarily. If one downgrades to a lesser model, it would obviously mean that it would cost less.

I hope you didn’t mean the demographics of this thread is for cheapies.

Yes, the NZ is a excellent bleeding edge PDA. Except.

;)

[johnfox]

Redmond, To kind of sum up the long thread, Thanks for sharing your problems, opinions and findings on another fine Sony PDA. Without forums like this where we can express these, we would all be buying in a vacuum. As it has been said many times here, "your mileage, time use may vary". We all got PDAs for different uses and reasons so of course battery times, memory usage and usefulness will vary. For me, the NX fits the bill, but who knows, I had an NR and jumped ship. If something comes out that contains the value and features I need.... I'll do the same. Until them..I love my NX.

Thanks again

PS...are you tired of the rain yet? finally...theres snow in them thar hills!

John

[Redmond]

Originally posted by johnfox
Redmond, To kind of sum up the long thread, Thanks for sharing your problems, opinions and findings on another fine Sony PDA. Without forums like this where we can express these, we would all be buying in a vacuum. As it has been said many times here, "your mileage, time use may vary". We all got PDAs for different uses and reasons so of course battery times, memory usage and usefulness will vary. For me, the NX fits the bill, but who knows, I had an NR and jumped ship. If something comes out that contains the value and features I need.... I'll do the same. Until them..I love my NX.

Thanks again

PS...are you tired of the rain yet? finally...theres snow in them thar hills!

John

Johnfox, thanks for your excellent précis of this thread.

Boy, I wasn’t expecting 52 replies 637 views!!

I live in Redmond, Washington just a half mile from Microsoft. Yes it rains here a lot. I’m thinking of moving to a sunnier part of the country but just can’t whip up enough time and energy to doing it. I’m hoping it might help me get rid of webbed feet problem.

;)

[johnfox]

Thanks Redmond, I'm in Bellevue, half mile from Microsoft (one of the many campus in the area)

John

[Redmond]

Howdy neighbor!!

[Importluva]

Its obvious that many of you don't like the NZ. So here is the simple solution. I will take care of it for you. Please mail me any and all NZs that you may not like. Thank you.

[Redmond]

On contraire messieurs, I think three’s quite a large following of the NZ-90. I would have too, if it wasn't for. . . .

Importluva, you forgot to include your mailing address!!

[lanchman]

Redmond, I wish you would have called before you traded it in. I'm in Kirkland and would have gladly stopped by and swapped out my NX for your NZ. :-) I'm sure I could find a good use for yours...smuggle it across the border to our friends to the North, I think they are just now receiving theirs.

I think the battery issues/concerns are crazy. Who would thing that the same device would have soooo many different outcomes.

[Redmond]

Originally posted by lanchman
Redmond, I wish you would have called before you traded it in. I'm in Kirkland and would have gladly stopped by and swapped out my NX for your NZ. :-) I'm sure I could find a good use for yours...smuggle it across the border to our friends to the North, I think they are just now receiving theirs.

I think the battery issues/concerns are crazy. Who would thing that the same device would have soooo many different outcomes.

Ooooh, another neighbor! Hi ya lanchman!
Man is the Seattle area just full of us geeks or what?

Yeah, we could've worked something out with the swap. . .but TOO LATE!!

Maybe the battery stuff is over played. But if they're real, we as consumers should put some pressure on SONY to remedy the situation. Especially to the NZ owners.

Remember when HP Jornad had the bogus 65K color TFT issue?

I feel sorry for the Canadians. USA! USA! USA!

[Redmond]

Well Boys and Girls,

There’s still one unanswered question I had about the NZ-90 Spare Battery.

That is: Is there an external charger for it $$, or do you have to charge it internally in the NZ-90?
Another words, charge the Primary then the Spare Battery? 4 hours each??

I noticed in another thread that there’s a 2.5 week wait on the Battery.

Oh well,

At 59 Replies and 787 Views, I think I should put this thread to rest. I’ve over stayed my visit.

To all of you who participated, THANK YOU!!!

To all of you that read this thread, I hope you gained something from it.

All together now, to the tune of “Mickey Mouse”

Now it’s time to say good-bye,
To all our family,
M-Y-------C....L-I-E …………N-Z-----Nine—ty!!

Live long and prosper!

Redmond OUT!!

:):) :)

[rlc7254]

Originally posted by Redmond
Thanks for the heads up reggae.

I'll know NOT to complain about green grass.

How does that go now? "the grass is greener on the NX side of the fence" ??

;)

 

Yes, it can be greener, but you don't know what the other side of the fence is using for fertilizer.

 ;)

[Redmond]

Greetings All!!

I couldn't help it. I just had to see what's going on. . . .

Just wanted to say that my NX us working out just perrrrfect for me.
The Camera App on the NX is more Battery friendly than my old NZ.
Remember, all I wanted the Camera for was to take thumbnails of my Contacts
And NOT as a 2MB photo taker.

It’s kinda amusing to read the other posts regarding the different ways you have to CONSERVE battery power on the NZ.. . . .
- Turning down the Brightness
- Turning off the IR
- Minimizing the use of WiFi
- Turning off the Flash while in the Camera App
- Avoiding the Camera App altogether
- Various (careful) ways of draining/charging the Battery

Why for?? All to SAVE Battery Power on the NZ?

Are we admitting something here? Are we trying to look the other way? Admission is sometimes a hard thing to swallow.

Why do all of you NZ Owners have to make CONCESSIONS?

It’s all COSTING you odd functional NX operational peculiarities, let alone the $$$ for a $$$pare batterie$$. And you know what? $ONY’$ lovin’ you for it!!

These are all functional reasons why I switched to the NX besides the $$$ issue.

[Redmond]

Have you counted lately?

$799.00 for the NZ-90
$149.00 for the WiFi (which $ONY should have BUILT-IN)
$ 80.00 for an $pare Battery (which $ONY should have INCLUDED)
$ 99.00 CompUSA Warranty
$ 60.00 for a 128MB Memory Stick (SONY should have included atleast 64MB)
$ 60.00 for a Case that fits?? (even more for a Vaja)
$1247 TOTAL BEFORE TAX!!! (8.8% in WA State = $1356.73)

That’s $1356.73 for a frikin’ PDA! #@#$#@!!!!

Read it: One Thousand Three Hundred Fifty Six Dollars and Seventy Three Cents.

And that’s NOT counting the $$$ for software yet either!

I know our nation and economy is nearing a time of crisis and you all want to help in any way you can right?

$ONY Thanks You.