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kennyd

02-23-2003, 12:24 PM

I just saw a another thread with a question on launcher comparisons.  The first two replies directed the original post to LaunchPlug.com.  I fully agree with the responses.  I hope every newbie will thouroughly browse and understand that site.  Brian has done excellent work there and has helped alot of users understand VFS.  Though Brians site is very informative and has excellent reviews on launchers, it is only his input as to launcher comparisons.  I would like to propose an idea I had that might help eliminate redundunt posts in regard to launcher comparisons.  It seems that there are four primary launchers that have made it as far as having a cult following.

MegaLuancher
Yi Show
ZLancher
LauncherX

I think it would be helpful to have our own launcher comparison rewiews.  Each review being an opinionated one (we shouldn't have a problem doing that:)) supporting the writers favorite launcher and comparing thier favorite to the others posted above.  Anyone intersted in doing that could post their opinions in the form of a review in this thread.  The four most informative reviews could be collaborated into a single tutorial that newbies could be directed to when the question is posed.  "What's the best launcher",  "LauncherX vs ZLauncher?" etc.  If we could do it I really do think that this could be a lot more informative and helpful to questions like that.

gvtexas

02-23-2003, 01:25 PM

Originally posted by kennyd
The four most informative reviews could be collaborated into a single tutorial that newbies could be directed to when the question is posed.  "What's the best launcher",  "LauncherX vs ZLauncher?"

What...and deprive them the joy of a frustrated search or the berations of members for not searching? Seriously, don't see much of that here (the berating), but on other forums a lot of the equivalent of RTFM!

Sounds like a decent idea...but I've learned to live without a launcher and am quite happy with the combo of programs I use to achieve that...so do you want an "unLauncher" review as well?

:eek:

MacClie

02-23-2003, 01:31 PM

Originally posted by kennyd
...It seems that there are four primary launchers that have made it as far as having a cult following.
ZLauncher
No, I think there is only one . . . :D

- MacClie

__________________
See that the President, the Cabinet and staff are informed. If cut out of the information flow, their decisions may be poor, not made, or not confidently or persuasively implemented. - Donald Rumsfeld

That figures, Donald, that figures . . . :rolleyes:

tanker_bob

02-23-2003, 01:49 PM

There are reviews of ZLauncher 2.21, MegaLauncher 4, YiShow 5.2, and Facer 1.5.7 on PDA Avenue (http://www.pdaavenue.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=3). They are somewhat opinionated. :) I'm sure there is a review of LauncherX somewhere.

wellsjs

02-23-2003, 02:02 PM

MacClie,

Is your avatar what you do to people who don't use ZLauncher? :eek: I'm going to PalmGear right now to buy "Z!" :D

MacClie

02-23-2003, 02:12 PM

Originally posted by wellsjs
MacClie,

Is your avatar what you do to people who don't use ZLauncher? :eek: I'm going to PalmGear right now to buy "Z!" :D You are catching on fast, wellsjs ;)

You know it makes sense :D

AND it's for your own good :D

LOL BTW

- MacClie

__________________
See that the President, the Cabinet and staff are informed. If cut out of the information flow, their decisions may be poor, not made, or not confidently or persuasively implemented. - Donald Rumsfeld

That figures, Donald, that figures . . . :rolleyes:

ckmoose

02-23-2003, 02:39 PM

I'm a registered MegaLauncher user. I love it...But, ever since the 4.x upgrade, there is a derth of skins. So, out of curiosity, I downloaded ZLauncher...It took a little while to get used to the prefs and interface. But, I must say. It's very nice, very customizable and really inexpensive.

Making you own backgrounds With ZL is stupidly easy, where ML requires a bit of Photoshop knowlege and much more time.

I find that I still miss the feel of ML, but I think I'll get over it.

rhart00

02-23-2003, 03:15 PM

Originally posted by kennyd
I just saw a another thread with a question on launcher comparisons.  The first two replies directed the original post to LaunchPlug.com.  I fully agree with the responses.  I hope every newbie will thouroughly browse and understand that site.  Brian has done excellent work there and has helped alot of users understand VFS.  Though Brians site is very informative and has excellent reviews on launchers, it is only his input as to launcher comparisons.  I would like to propose an idea I had that might help eliminate redundunt posts in regard to launcher comparisons.  It seems that there are four primary launchers that have made it as far as having a cult following.

MegaLuancher
Yi Show
ZLancher
LauncherX

I think it would be helpful to have our own launcher comparison rewiews.  Each review being an opinionated one (we shouldn't have a problem doing that:)) supporting the writers favorite launcher and comparing thier favorite to the others posted above.  Anyone intersted in doing that could post their opinions in the form of a review in this thread.  The four most informative reviews could be collaborated into a single tutorial that newbies could be directed to when the question is posed.  "What's the best launcher",  "LauncherX vs ZLauncher?" etc.  If we could do it I really do think that this could be a lot more informative and helpful to questions like that.

Congratulations!!! You are the 10,000th person to bring this up. have a cookie

yorrick

02-23-2003, 03:32 PM

I have registered for quite a few Launchers - and this is more of a reflection on what I think of them. I don't rate this as a "review" per se.
1) Launch'Em (by Synergy Solutions (http://www.synsolutions.com/))
2) LauncherX (by Benc (http://www.benc.hr/))
3) Launcher III (predecessor to LauncherX - Benc (http://www.benc.hr/))
4) MegaLauncher (by MegaSoft2000 (http://www.megasoft2000.com/))
5) ZLauncher (by ZZTechs (http://www.zztechs.com/))

Why so many? Features and support.
LaunchEm was great under OS3.X but they lost the plot when they didn't support VFS (ie. no MMC/SD/MS).
So I jumped to MegaLauncher in mid-2002 as I had purchased a T615C. It looked a lot better than LaunchEm and LauncherIII since it had hi-res (I had a new CLIE and was enamoured by hi-res! :) ).
By early 2002, YiLauncher and ZLauncher was released and iterative releases, became very stable. It had a swag of features not present in MegaLauncher - but my concern was stability with such early releases.

The much vaunted vapourware - LauncherX - finally appeared in 3/4 quarter of 2002. I went for the upgrade and it promptly crashed my device! After the second release - some issues were resolved. What turned me off LX was the crashing bit and the poor support to resolve these issues (like suggesting that I uninstall Jackflash to get LX running!!!)

By late 2002 - YiShow and ZLauncher were packing in functionality and fixes at a phenominal rate for me to revisit them. I was pretty much blown away by the features and stability. I decided to register ZLauncher over YiShow - but the decision was very, very close.

MegaLauncher was re-released in early 2003. After much hype and hoopla, ML had a few new features, but the let down was the lack of new features to compete with ZL or YiShow ... and they had over 6-9 months after they were released.
After MegaLauncher 4 wiped my CLIE three or four times (ie. hard reset after it hung), I thought I'd wait for a release or two to pass before I'd revisit it. As of this time, I have not received any reply from such a critical defect from Megasoft2000 support.

It is less to do with the features I wanted in a Launcher than two issues (that would apply to everyone).
1) The features I wanted is present.
2) Support for any problems to be addressed in a timely manner (and two to four weeks is a tad too long...)

At this point in time, if someone walked up to me and asked "which Launcher I would recommend?" I would rank it as:
equal 1) ZLauncher or YiShow.
3) ZLauncherX (for the skins ... but that's about it)
4) MegaLauncher (so much hype, so under-whelming!)

One observation. There is a convergence between Launchers (such as YiShow and ZL) and file managers (PiMoverII, McFile, FileZ) which was more or less expected. Likewise, the expectation that a Launcher functions as a File Manager would be coming to the fore. IMO - Launchers that fail to support this functionality (LX or ML...) will be left behind.

Sorry if I rambled on too long... :)

rhart00

02-23-2003, 04:12 PM

thanks for that great summary yorrick. I have had a similar experience over the years. The following are the launchers I have registered since I first got my first pda:

1. MegaLauncher
2. Yishow
3. ZLauncher
4. Launch'Em
5. Silver Screen
6. Facer (if you consider this a launcher. bought it cause I like the today page. I hate the launcher part)

I currently use ZLauncher as my default launcher on my NX. nothing else

PhilB

02-23-2003, 04:24 PM

Just to pop in w/my $.02. After traveling through the Dark Side and back to Palm OS5 via Palm T|T and then to an NZ90 (whee hoo!) I'm trying to get a Launcher that I can live with.

If LauncherX would give better support and put backgrounds in (after PPC I'm a sucker for backgrounds. I mean we have these great screens. Why not use them? Just MHO).

Anyway, never a big Yishow fan because of the way it works and some bad press here. (But really nice pictures).

Which brings me to "ta dah" ZLauncher. Seems to be everybody's favorite, but the look and especially the feel make me want to hit my Clie with a hammer. No offence to all you ZL lovers, but it still separates the Internal and Card views. The built-in launcher does that. And it always seems to have a heck of a time finding some of files when you're trying to customize it.

So, right now, my main Launcher is MegaLauncher 4.1. It's never crashed on me. And it does offer backgrounds...although difficult to make. But it is so HUGE. Almost 2 megs!
But the best things to me are: speed, eaze of use (IMHO), graphical interface (Yes, I'm a Mac fan), and, most important, the integration of the MS in the views. With less than 11 MB internal to deal with, I like keeping all the apps I can on my MS and then seeing it all together with those little MS images in the corner. But I can't get ML to work well from the MS! Darn! Darn! Darn! Darn!

I would love someone to tell me how to make ZL use or give me some outstanding reason to use it. Maybe these will all evolve to some better place. I hope so.

Anita

02-23-2003, 04:25 PM

Redundant tho the launcher threads may be, there is often some little tip, tweak or how-to buried in each one of them -- something new that hasn't been posted before.

For me, the instant user response on Cliesource (with version releases on launchers) has been a major source of information -- and was responsible for me trying out Zlauncher again, after rejecting it a couple of times before.

The thing about launcher reviews is they have to be updated with each version release, since most of them are changing pretty dramatically between versions. A review of five launchers today isn't going to yield the same results as a review of the same five launchers even just a month ago.

I think the www.launchplug.com comparison chart for main features is VERY helpful -- but like reviews, it has to be steadily updated. I keep hoping someone will contribute an update on Megalauncher, just because I'm curious how it stacks up now.

Anita

tanker_bob

02-23-2003, 04:34 PM

Originally posted by PhilB
Which brings me to "ta dah" ZLauncher. Seems to be everybody's favorite, but the look and especially the feel make me want to hit my Clie with a hammer. No offence to all you ZL lovers, but it still separates the Internal and Card views. The built-in launcher does that. And it always seems to have a heck of a time finding some of files when you're trying to customize it.

I think what you are trying to say is that ZLauncher keeps card apps in a separate category in the Launcher. Not so. You can put apps from the card in any category and they stay there. The built-in does not do that.

The separate card tab/category in ZLauncher has a different purpose and is more capable than the built-in, which just shows the content of /Palm/Launcher. ZLauncher's is really just a step towards a file manager. You can go anywhere on the card in that tab and copy, move, etc. It even has a tree view for the destination and for picking the displayed directory. It defaults to the /Palm/Launcher directory when first installed, so maybe that's why you got the impression you seem to have.

JC2K

02-23-2003, 04:59 PM

Originally posted by yorrick
...
Likewise, the expectation that a Launcher functions as a File Manager would be coming to the fore. IMO - Launchers that fail to support this functionality (LX or ML...) will be left behind.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but LX has the best file manager available to date in a launcher. It is comparable to McFile in the functionality and simplicity and has prompted other launcher developers to put full fledged file managers on their "To Do" lists.

The tabbed verison of card navigation isn't as functional, nor elegant as the McFile style approach.

Hope this information helps!

tanker_bob

02-23-2003, 05:13 PM

That's unbelievable. I just wrote a 15 minute exposition on Launchers and it just vaporized!!! :mad:

Here we go again...

I started with Launcher III's freeware predecessor on my Palm Vx back in '99. I like the tabs and stuff, but was lured away by Launch'Em's gadgets. After playing with Launch 'Em for a short time, I registered it in early '00 and used until I sold my Vx in favor of a T615C in January of '01.

Launch 'Em didn't support hi res or VFS, which became requirements on the T615C. So, I stared looking and reading the boards, and found MegaLauncher 3.2.2 in January '01. It not only look great, but sported even greater power than Launch 'Em's gadgets. I was hooked and registered it. It happily ran on my T615C and later my T665C for almost a year.

A year is an eternity in this market, and ML3 was showing its age. Both YiShow and ZLauncher supported 16-bit color interfaces, plus backgrounds. I grew tired of waiting for ML4 vaporware. I steered clear of YiShow because of the constant reports on the boards of bugs and crashes. I downloaded ZLauncher in mid-January '02, and put it through the ringer for about an hour. It had a great balance between appearance, power, and ease of use. Man, was I impressed! I registered it immediately--a record time for me. I made about two dozen backgrounds in one night using stuff that came with WinXP or OfficeXP. Very cool. :cool:

I considered LauncherX briefly, but it was constantly delayed. When it finally came out, I was very disappointed. It didn't support backgrounds, active skins, and several other things that were promised. Sorry.

When MegaLauncher 4 came out, I tried it immediately. Another disappointment. Although I never experienced a crash, it was just ML3 with support for a 16-bit color interface. Is that the best they could do after a year of dead silence? I expected much more. Plus, I have no idea how to make backgrounds for it. Hmph.

Another major consideration for me was customer support or the lack thereof. I wrote the Launch 'Em folks several times about VFS and hi res support, only to get silence or the stiff arm. MegaSoft2000 kept saying any day for several months, and didn't seem to even get serious until ZL 2 came out. Also, I have never gotten FastCPU 3.0 to work worth a darn on my T665C. Initially, MegaSoft worked with me on it, but then grew silent. It still doesn't work, but nothing from MegaSoft. OTOH, ZZTechs answers all my emails within a couple of days, usually within a couple of hours. The update regularly and incorporate all reasonable user requests. Couldn't ask for more.

So, I'm delighted with ZLauncher. It just keeps getting better, while the others try to catch up either in features, stability, or ease of use.

n2ifp

02-23-2003, 06:38 PM

Originally posted by tanker_bob

I think what you are trying to say is that ZLauncher keeps card apps in a separate category in the Launcher. Not so. You can put apps from the card in any category and they stay there. The built-in does not do that.

The separate card tab/category in ZLauncher has a different purpose and is more capable than the built-in, which just shows the content of /Palm/Launcher. ZLauncher's is really just a step towards a file manager. You can go anywhere on the card in that tab and copy, move, etc. It even has a tree view for the destination and for picking the displayed directory. It defaults to the /Palm/Launcher directory when first installed, so maybe that's why you got the impression you seem to have.

Very good!

n2ifp

02-23-2003, 06:44 PM

Everyone has different expectations from a Launcher. No one size fits all, only what one feels comfortable with. All the launchers have their good and bad points. One reason why ZLauncher is popular, is due to the high interaction with the developer.

PhilB

02-23-2003, 08:00 PM

Willber-Force

02-23-2003, 08:02 PM

Originally posted by kennyd
Each review being an opinionated one

Okay, okay. Here's mine... :D :

First there's LauncherX. Don't even get me started with this pile of 1's and 0's. If there ever was a need for an example of hype for the dictionary, this is it. There was so much ranting and raving about this alleged gem of the launcher world my head spun. Everything from the "homer" button (which, to this day, I have no idea what it was supposed to do. They were so animate proclaiming that there was a "homer" button they forgot to tell us exactly what it did.) to active skins so you could put your tabs along the top, or along the bottom, or along the top and inverted or diagonally across the screen or one button on the left instead of the right (like it made a difference where the tabs were). They even told us there would be wallpaper. Look what we have now. The enigmatic "homer" button has remained in the shadows. Active Skins really haven't taken off to anything significant. And they still haven't figured out how to put an image in the background in time for its hyped up release date. Than there is their little marketing ploy to get people to buy the soon-to-be-outdated version so they can take a chunk out of the overly inflated price tag of LX (another marketing ploy, if you put a crazy price tag on it idiotic people will mindlessly think that there is something in it that warrants the insane price).

Than there's MegaLauncher. Could you possibly make the top and bottom bars any bigger? The bottom 4 buttons (The most they can do with a space that is 320pixles wide is put FOUR buttons on it?!) are so big it would be no trouble to use my forehead as a stylus and accurately tap on them. And if you don't want tabs the top bar has enough empty real estate that it is second only to the polar ice caps. Than it doesn't even have the other features we have all grown to expect from a launcher. No file manager. No wallpaper. MegaSoft really needs to get on the ball with this one.

And than there is SilverScreen. With a bottom bar that even puts MegaLuancher to shame. What goes through these developers' heads anyway? Are icons of a reasonable size too much to ask? What's next, a launcher with one 230X320 icon that takes up the entire screen? Ooooh you can customize it, that's a big plus. :rolleyes: The developer hasn't even released a OS5 version which, to me, answers the question of whether the load of features which are absent are going to one day appear.

Than there's YiShow. Ahhhh, YiShow. The beautiful queen of launchers. Everything you could possibly want in a launcher. The looks are absolutely beautiful. High resolution icons whit a colour depth to make skinners gitty (did I mention they are of a reasonable size? I probably should mention that). Background support so you can complement your beautiful skin with a background that is equally as beautiful. And a skin and wallpaper manager so you can load skins faster than rounds on a gatling gun. Easily accessed icons to do all the common tasks such as beam and delete add the functionality you could need. But if that wasn't enough, Yi Bing had to push it the extra mile. He has tried to make a launcher similar to Explorer. A file manager, launcher and file viewer all rolled into one. All these features are elegantly and flawlessly merged into one magnificent piece of programming art we all know as YiShow.

opinionated enough? :confused: :D

Disclaimer: For those who will take me 101% seriously and inevitably comment on this you should remember.... ahh, nevermind. If you don't get it I couldn't care a less. :D

Sid

02-23-2003, 08:11 PM

Originally posted by Willber-Force
[B]

Okay, okay. Here's mine... :D :
<snip>
Than there's MegaLauncher. Could you possibly make the top and bottom bars any bigger? The bottom 4 buttons (The most they can do with a space that is 320pixles wide is put FOUR buttons on it?!) are so big it would be no trouble to use my forehead as a stylus and accurately tap on them. And if you don't want tabs the top bar has enough empty real estate that it is second only to the polar ice caps. Than it doesn't even have the other features we have all grown to expect from a launcher. No file manager. No wallpaper. MegaSoft really needs to get on the ball with this one.

<snip>
opinionated enough? :confused: :D /B]

Forehead as a stylus LOL! :D
Good review.

sebring

02-23-2003, 08:30 PM

It's rumored that using your forehead as a stylus can cause serious brain damage. Perhaps that explains the rest of the review.:D

Willber-Force

02-23-2003, 08:39 PM

Originally posted by sebring
It's rumored that using your forehead as a stylus can cause serious brain damage. Perhaps that explains the rest of the review.:D

As you should be able to tell, I use YiShow. Obviously I am not the one suffering from Stylus-brain damage here.

:p

tanker_bob

02-23-2003, 08:46 PM

Originally posted by Willber-Force

Okay, okay. Here's mine... :D :

ROFLMAO!!!!!!! So, don't hold back--what do you really think?

yorrick

02-23-2003, 08:57 PM

I thought the only people to use their forehead as a stylus own PPCs...

<Yorrick now dons asbestos suit>

LaStigmata

02-23-2003, 09:11 PM

I think the forehead stylus is how this thread got started. http://www.cliesource.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4715

Willber-Force

02-23-2003, 09:16 PM

Originally posted by tanker_bob

ROFLMAO!!!!!!! So, don't hold back--what do you really think?

Actually what I said was pretty close to what I really thought. I was just sheltering my opinions from comments by those launcher-apostate's with the umbrella of humor.

:D

I like your quote from Dave BTW. :D

tanker_bob

02-23-2003, 09:20 PM

Originally posted by Willber-Force
I like your quote from Dave BTW. :D
He sometimes knows how to get to the heart of a matter... ;)

kennyd

02-23-2003, 10:44 PM

I have registered version of LauncherX.  I'm also an old LauncherIII user.  LauncherIII is the predesesser of LauncherX.  

 When I upgraded from LIII to LX I really did appreciate the upgrade ...

a full featured file browser as nice as McFile with gadget accessibility,
more customizable text & icons,
more gadgets,
the ability to store apps in the card in as many custom directories as you choose
the inumerable custom directories mentioned above are all supporting seamless catagorization of apps without the need for shortcuts!!!  (To date LX is the only Launcher with VFS this robust)
customizable skins 
Making Launchable icons of databases associated not only of your hackmanager of choice and doc reader of choice but also iSilo, QuickWord, and WordSmith.

 ...but found nothing lacking in LauncherIII in respect to functionality. LauncherIII was already truly VFS aware.  LIII went beyond the VFS awareness that the built in launcher was capable of.  The built in provides a single catagory that houses all of your apps stored on the card.  The apps stored in that catagory are not capable of being catagorized beyond that point. 

A TRIBUTE TO LAUNCHERIII

VFS ENHANCED:  With LIII a whole new idea was developed (and as far as I know LIII really is the pioneer of this interface.  If LIII wasn't the first it was one of the first).  LIII enables all apps launched from the card to be recognized as if they are stored in ram so that catagorization is absolutely unhindered and seemless.  You do not need to make a shortcut for the simple purpose of catagorizing an app.  This is development that most of the more recent additions to the launcher list have not yet caught up to.  LIII took the bar even higher with shortcuts (another pioneering point of development). 

SHORT CUTS:  With shortcuts you can make every app stored on a card even more recognizable than the already pioneered VFS enhancement mentioned above.  Now all of those apps stored on the card are seen in every respect as being in RAM.  Desktop conduits are now recognizing the apps on the card, and system enhancements such as swithcheroo, EasyLaunch, and SilkHack see the apps also. 

I'm not trying to slam any other launcher with this post, but just offering up a level of grattitude to Benc for pioneering the trails that others are now riding on.  And mentioning some features that other launchers will need to develop before they have really caught my attention. 

Where does ZLauncher fit into all of this? 
I have also downloaded ZLauncher, set it up and used it, just to see what the rave has been all about.  It became evident to me that each app is only slightly similar but distinct enough to call them different machines.  LX and ZL do not think alike.  I choose LX not only for reason of the features listed above but for its speed (on my SJ30 at normal speed LX is much faster at not only loading, but also switching tabs), stability (I personally have not had one issue with LX aside from adding it to the SwitchDash exception list, not abnormal), and interface (in other words it's thinking process and look).  Backgrounds really are neat to look at, but the graphics cause me to fumble around too long looking for a file.  That coupled with an already encumbered launcher make ZLaunchers added features disinteresting to me, but I can understand why backgrounds are important to others and can't blame anyone for raving about the cost and support for ZLauncher in comparison to LX, the later I can not even comment on because I haven't had a need to contact Benc. I upgraded to LX for $4, but I personally would have stuck with LIII over ZLauncher up to this point, if LX had not been better than both.  Maybe if I were buying my first launcher I would've gone for Z.  But functionality and ease at this point are more important to me than graphics.  There's obviously nothing wrong with either, but anyone comparing to two launchers should consider both sides of the post.  To date ZLauncher has the VFS catagorizing capability that LIII had, but beyond that you must either use ZLaunchers shortcuts to catch up to LX's VFS catagorizing capability, or settle for using ZLaunchers file manager to launch apps stored in directories other than /Palm/Launcher/.. 
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