UX will be a mistake.

[Deep blue Sky]

I know this will make a lot of fans unhappy but the truth is that the latest Clie offer is no longer a palm, but more like a palm top computer.

Despite all the request for a T series with VG, they came out with a palm top that makes the user rely on both hands to type. The ease of use and the "take it out, jog a note like it is a piece of paper" thing is gone. If you take that price together then it is way too expensive. I admire the feature set and the specs but for such a design I have nothing to say except to disagree.

On ther other hand it seems that the rumored T3 got a VG with a thin form factor. Even though I hate the sliding design at least someone is listening to what people really want.

When will Sony listen?
:confused:

[lostether]

This is just one model in an extensive line of Clie's and although it isn't for me I can definitely see a market for it. It is a palm top computer, and is about at the point where there is little reason to lug a laptop around with you anymore. If instead of picsel viewer is came with an office suite that can not only view but create and edit native windows office files, it would be there.

[falafel]

Originally posted by Deep blue Sky
I know this will make a lot of fans unhappy but the truth is that the latest Clie offer is no longer a palm, but more like a palm top computer.



Ok, so its a Palm top, and not a Palm. Now help me understand, because i'm a bit confused.... Why should this make me "unhappy"? Did Sony corner me at gunpoint and say, "Buy the ux50 or else?"

[Unregistered]

as usual, the point is missed

[falafel]

as usual, the unregistered user posts an esoteric, ambiguous comment

[Brokken]

Sony is not making anyone buy it at gunpoint - as Falafel correctly points out - but I do believe that Sony is getting away from the original philosophy of the Palm device. Stating opinion is what the forum is all about. Everyone gets a say.

[Deep blue Sky]

Originally posted by falafel



Ok, so its a Palm top, and not a Palm. Now help me understand, because i'm a bit confused.... Why should this make me "unhappy"? Did Sony corner me at gunpoint and say, "Buy the ux50 or else?"

If you are a fan then by definition (fanatics) you would like whatever Sony CLIE comes out with. Ordinary CLIE users would be quite skeptical about this because it doesn't fit into the original idea of a PDA and moving closer towards a computer. The beauty of the Palm software is that it can be thought of as a notepad but with a wide range of capabilities. The fans would think that we are crazy for not loving the device ('unhappy')

I personally don't need to be held at gunpoint to be unhappy about certain things. If you don't feel unhappy about my comments regarding the UX that's just means that you are not a fan, that' all.

[Joel]

I'm a fanatic. But I don't see non-fanatics as crazy for not loving the UX :D Simply put, if a person does not like the UX then it's because the device is not targetted at that person. There are so many choices for PDA's now. Sony just added something into the mix. So now, it's up to us to choose what PDA suits our needs.

I have an NX70V and I'm still in love with it (the CF card support sorta gave it a second life). ;) Come to think of it, I have no use for the UX because we don't have WiFi hotspots here in Guam. The UX is nice but it's simply not for me.

[Unregistered]

I like the the UX's form factor. Since I had retired, my needs have changed. I find that the desktop model preferable now.

[n2ifp]

Originally posted by Unregistered
I like the the UX's form factor. Since I had retired, my needs have changed. I find that the desktop model preferable now.

Hmm, I am getting logged out more frequently now??

I think what many are upset about is that Sony didn't come out with what they wanted instead.

[Orincarnia]

interesting, i'm being ripped and torn between wanting it cause it looks cool and its different, and not wanting it cause it has that big border to the screen, last time i got the first generation of something it had bugs and i was allergic to it --metaphorically-- (i kept dropping the phone)
how long till they release the next of it? i'm starting college and i'd like to stop changing laptops every year cause of speed and have one device that'll last me 4 years........will this device be it?

[Joel]

Orincarnia, for me, your NX70V, A460, and R505 is a way cool combination of tools for college! :D

[archangel]

Its not going to be a mistake in Japan which is the main market for the Clie.

[SumDumGuy]

Originally posted by archangel
Its not going to be a mistake in Japan which is the main market for the Clie.

Clie may hold the number one market share in Japan, but wouldn't the US be the main market? PDAs are much more prevelant here - in Japan everyone does it all with their cell phones.

[Jezlyn]

The thing with Sony is that they were never going for the "Palm Zen" philosophy. Otherwise, they wouldn't be marketing their devices as personal entertainment organizers (or whatever their exact phrase was). Palm gears its devices more toward executive users and those users more interested in functionality and simple elements. Sony doesn't do simple. :) Even their low-end devices have entertainment elements built into their design. Sony's philosophy is to amaze their customers with the wow factor, joy and wonder (hey, it's not me who picked the wording, this is from their execs and CEO). I have this book on the founding of Sony (haven't finished it yet) and it describes how the founders were excited about all sorts of different toys and gadgets and wanted to build that type of "fun-ness" into their products (I'm not describing it as eloquently as the book does). Combine that "fun" philosophy along with the ever-changing, fickle Japanese market, and you can see why Sony makes the products they do. They like experimentation, whereas Palm likes to go with the tried and true. Yes, Palm is starting to innovate a little bit with their products now, but they're never going to make a "wild and crazy" device like Sony does. Sony is always going to put their Japanese market first; that's just the way they operate.

[Unregistered]

still confused ... if a desktop fits your new needs why not just use a desktop computer?

[ssulux]

i love my nx80 but i don't think ux is a mistake.

it is good for us that sony does an intensive development and comes out with so many breakthrough design.

i think ux will be cuter if only it has full screen (640x480 is even better) and reduce the bezel size.

also cutting the bottom part of the keyboard will make it slimmer, i mean the 1cm side whereas the jog dial and 4 other buttons. it will make this ux looks exactly like the prototype.

[sindu]

I am a busy executive who happen to be a Palm fanatic. I use my Clie for business communication tool apart from its PIM function. UX with its landscape, backlit keyboard, piscel, WIFI, and BT is a perfect communication tool for me so that I can be easily reach by other members in the organizaiton or I can reach my colleagues instantly. I am not disappointed with Sony but rather glad that they came up with UX to keep me from moving to the "dark side".

[ksjenkins]

Originally posted by Deep blue Sky
I know this will make a lot of fans unhappy but the truth is that the latest Clie offer is no longer a palm, but more like a palm top computer.

Despite all the request for a T series with VG, they came out with a palm top that makes the user rely on both hands to type. The ease of use and the "take it out, jog a note like it is a piece of paper" thing is gone. If you take that price together then it is way too expensive. I admire the feature set and the specs but for such a design I have nothing to say except to disagree.

On ther other hand it seems that the rumored T3 got a VG with a thin form factor. Even though I hate the sliding design at least someone is listening to what people really want.

When will Sony listen?
:confused:

 

You can always wait until the T series with VG comes out... Say about December!:p  Or you can just complain that it's not happening fast enough, or complain that the newest Clie wasn't designed with the other 90% of the market in mind. Why not the NZ90 or the NX80 they both have the VG your looking for and you don't have to wait another day!

 

 :)

 

 

 

[Deep blue Sky]

Originally posted by ksjenkins


 

You can always wait until the T series with VG comes out... Say about December!:p  Or you can just complain that it's not happening fast enough, or complain that the newest Clie wasn't designed with the other 90% of the market in mind. Why not the NZ90 or the NX80 they both have the VG your looking for and you don't have to wait another day!


 :)

 

If it has to be December then maybe I'll wait. But then if Palm listens and come out with a really workable T3 then I'll purchase. I thought about those machines but they have more feature sets than what I want and a much heavier case. If I don't plan to use the keyboard & camera why carry one with the extra weight?

Sooner or later Sony would realize why they lose market share even though they are the most innovative, because they do not listen:o

[ddsmith]

I think that the UX landscape design will encourage software makers to add a landscape option to their product. This could actually help those of us with NX/NR that want landscape options in some programs.

[falafel]

Originally posted by ddsmith
I think that the UX landscape design will encourage software makers to add a landscape option to their product. This could actually help those of us with NX/NR that want landscape options in some programs.

You make a perceptive, and excellent point! Sony is not only thinking outside the box or outside the palm, if you will, but they are also creating incentive for software developers to hasten development of software for older device styles such as the NX80. In this light, Sony is possibly maneuvering towards creating a T-series form-factor Clie with a Hires+ 320x480 screen, but prior to releasing this much waited for device, they have found a clever way to make software developers start designing landscape versions of their software so that eventually, when they do release the t-series 320x480 res screen, the hoards of people who buy it will be even more satisfied because software that utlizes the "wideness" of their screens will already be available.
For those in this forum who chide Sony's UX series, I ask you to consider that Sony is thinking outside the palm, exploring the frontier of PDA concepts, and although all of us might not like every hardware concept they release, its their ability to speculate and take risks, to deliver what not all of us like, that will ultimately help them learn what we all actually do like!

[mvfrancisco]

Jezlyn, what's the name of that book? It sounds pretty interesting, I just hope it's in english.

I think the UX50 was just put out there to whet people's appetites... if it's really their bigtime business product, I think they would've waited for OS6, which with "enhanced management of wireless connections, richer security, and flexible input methods", has been labelled as a corporate-centric release and ideal for the UX50's target audience. Plus with the oncoming push of corporate instant messaging and all the blackberries, Sony HAS to be working on implementing GSM and of course always-on GPRS.

At least that's what *I'm* going to be holding out for.

[gojira]

My guess is also the keyboard of the UX will appeal to the people who like "thumbboards" like on RIM devices or the Treo.

[Jezlyn]

Jezlyn, what's the name of that book? It sounds pretty interesting, I just hope it's in english.

Yep, it's in English. :) It's called Sony: The Private Life. Sorry about the long link below, but it is the Amazon listing for the book:

Amazon page for Sony: The Private Life (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0395893275/qid=1058811395/sr=1-19/ref=sr_1_19/104-5021569-2857552?v=glance&s=books)

So far it really is a good book. I've been quite the Sony fan for a while now (not just when they started making Clies), so it's pretty interesting to me. :) Plus I am very interested in Japanese culture, so this was a good birthday present.

[EdFrmBrighthand]

Originally posted by mvfrancisco
I think the UX50 was just put out there to whet people's appetites... if it's really their bigtime business product, I think they would've waited for OS6, which with "enhanced management of wireless connections, richer security, and flexible input methods", has been labelled as a corporate-centric release and ideal for the UX50's target audience.
PalmSource CEO David Nagel said recently that Palm OS 6, code-named Sahara, will still be in beta at the end of this year and won't be in consumers' hands until six months later. A year is a long time for Sony to hold the UX series waiting for a new OS. However, I'm sure Sony will put out something like these models with the new OS, when it's available.

[mvfrancisco]

thanks editor from brighthand... I guess you're right, what might be a long time for Sony may be a perfectly reasonable timeframe for a consumer to hold onto their hard earned $700 in order to get the features they want. At the very least they've convinced me to hold out a little longer and not buy the Tungsten T3 or the Handspring Treo 600 the instant one of them's available. Gotta wait to see what the boys from Tokyo are going to come out with...

Jezlyn, that book looks pretty interesting... Sony's always been one of those companies that are just synonymous with "cool ideas", like IDEO. i just put the book on my wish list, and hopefully i can find some toom for it on my summer reading list.

[mashoutposse]

I don't see why Sony should be pigeonholed into making simple, unexciting products just because the Zen of Palm says so...

[Jezlyn]

I don't see why Sony should be pigeonholed into making simple, unexciting products just because the Zen of Palm says so...

Right on! :)

Mvfrancisco: IDEO =is= a very cool company. From time to time I see news stories about their prototypes for other companies and I wish they'd actually make their prototypes! Very "out-of-the-box" thinking.

I don't know, has there ever been anything made by Sony that seemed all conservative? Sony's about style, and they have lots of it. :) They also have a lot of good engineers to create the substance behind the style.

Here are a couple links to some interesting short news stories I stumbled upon about the UX50 (sorry if these have been posted before):

http://www.siliconvalley.com/mld/siliconvalley/6339421.htm

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/business/6334589.htm

There isn't anything really new in these articles, but there is mention of why Sony created their own chip for this Clie.

[Unregistered]

A word of advice for Sony: Device can be fun, but make sure it has ergonomics.

Case: Apple Newton PDA. It has a lot of good features but they have been pushed to extinction for a simple flaw: the weight and the size. U.S. Robotics' Palm cannot do as much as Newton but they manage to get to down to a size where people like and a weight that users can carry. The rest is just history.

UX-50 is of course a very light-weight device (much lighter than NX), but its ergonomics is not as good as the NX, let alone a T-series. If some company (palm) comes up with a device that have adequate features and a good ergonomics design then I would assume that the UX would be stuck.

Earlier I asked on the web how much would people pay for a T series w/VG and the answer is 450. UX is really cannibalizing the NV series and if palm releases a T3, then UX will be going nowhere.

It is how innovative companies like Sony lose money.....

[Deep blue Sky]

I posted the above thread...

[Orincarnia]

well one thing about the apple newton, it wasn't meant for every day people, if you notice the newton is the exact size of a lab coat pocket

[kjbad]

I'm a safety engineer at a major semiconductor plant, and I have to say that I am more concerned about extended stylus use than I am with the small keyboards. We recently outfitted our entire site (~2000 employees) with Motorola Talkabout pagers (similar to UX 50 shape, smaller size) and have not seen an increase in ergonomic issues in over 1 yr of widespread use. I use an N610C now, but would switch to the UX50 in a heartbeat because I'm already used to the keyboard on the Talkabout.

I read on cnet.com that the UX50 screen swivels 180 degrees so that it can be used as a "traditional" PDA. I have no complaints, especially if I can use the wireless network in our plant to send and retrieve e-mail w/o a laptop. I also would use the digital camera to take incident scene photos. This could be the perfect device for me if everything *works*. We'll see...

[Sam K]

I like a lot of aspects of the UX-50 but I also dislike a few. I like the landscape design because I think it will make easier to read/view web pages and email. Plus that makes the keyboard more spread out so it should be easier to type with. Obviously having both Wifi and Bluetooth is a plus. I definitely want Wifi in my next PDA because of the hot spots popping up all over Manhattan since I plan on using it to read email and surf the web. I find reading email and surfing the web on my cell phone to be too slow between the slow access and the constant scrolling.

Here are my complaints about the UX series.
1) Wasted space aroung the screen. The screen could have been bigger by using more of the space around the frame of the screen.
2) The useless built-in camera. I don't need a camera in my PDA (especially if you're using it for business) but if you're going to put one in, make it at least 2 megapixels.
3) Not as much memory as the Tungsten C. They should have put 64mb in the UX series but maybe they didn't to increase sales of memory sticks.
4) The CPU. I understand that Sony designed this to be more multimedia oriented but I'm wondering how it's performance will compare with the 400MHz Intel PXA255.
5) Position of the jog dial. I don't think I'll be able to hold the UX and scroll using the jog dial with the same hand.

It's probably unfair to pass judgement now since I haven't seen it in person but I'll probably still get the UX-50 unless Palm comes out with something with built in Wifi (other than the Tungsten C) that blows it away.

[yoyolai]

Originally posted by falafel
as usual, the unregistered user posts an esoteric, ambiguous comment

Why don't you just go buy the SJ series? it's definitly a "PDA" instead of the palm top. Sony is providing more than one model for you to choose out there, no one says you can't buy SJ anymore. I'm sure you can still get a PalmPilot on the ebay, too.

[kjbad]

That camera comes in very handy for some of us...I don't like to carry a separate pager, PDA, camera, and MP3 player, but I use all of thme at various times. If the UX-50 is as advertised, it has immediate benefit for storage-challenged individuals like myself.

For what I would use it for - general scene photos to share in incident analysis - I am never caught without a camera, and it's small enough to keep on my person wherever I may be.

[JasonO]

Missing only 1 feature, or otherwise I'd be unable to stop myself from getting it. I like the remote commander software, and it doesn't look like this device has it. 7/32" thinner would be nice too (I like the T form factor).

Camera OK. It isn't intended to replace a digital camera. It's intended to supplement your palm experience and allow you to catch those "Argh, I wish I had my camera here" snapshots. I was wondering why they didn't have a 2mp camera with it too, but then I saw the price difference between the original and 2 MP camera on one of the other models is $200, and I don't need the extra mp for that price, especially since I have an expensive digital camera with a nice lens for the higher quality shots I need. But it's cool to snap a photo and stick it in your address book :)

I think putting the keyboard sideways is brilliant. Much better than trying to type on the thumbpads of the other clamshell designs. And of course the widescreen is a no-brainer -- isn't that how most of our TVs and computer monitors are?

My concerns: First, Sony proprietary chip, 1st gen. I'll be happy to wait and see it proved out in the market before I buy. Second, the behavior of landscape vs. portrait and if it's easy to switch between if you fold the keyboard back and use it as a traditional palm.

[Deep blue Sky]

Originally posted by kjbad
I'm a safety engineer at a major semiconductor plant, and I have to say that I am more concerned about extended stylus use than I am with the small keyboards. We recently outfitted our entire site (~2000 employees) with Motorola Talkabout pagers (similar to UX 50 shape, smaller size) and have not seen an increase in ergonomic issues in over 1 yr of widespread use. I use an N610C now, but would switch to the UX50 in a heartbeat because I'm already used to the keyboard on the Talkabout.



Actually you should not be concern with the stylus because UX-50 only appears in Landscape mode. To use the stylus you would have to put in your hand (left or right) like pointing with a camera or slide it in with your palm and have your thumb on top. It is a very awkward position to use the stylus and graffiti.

As an engineer you probably always carry a pen? Pick a sony stylus pen with pen/pencil/stylus would be quite sufficient for you.

Ergonomics is an issue and as I said, it would never be like the old days where "draw and jot" is as easy as pulling a paper out.

[Unregistered]

I am currently looking for a Palm / CE device to replace the HP Jornadas that my company uses for field engineers.

The UX looks a pretty good bet... something with a good screen and a keyboard that can run Cadenza from Commontime.

There are still lots of people who can type faster than they can write even on paper let alone on a PDA.

Long live the keyboard.

If anyone has actualy used a UX please post a message and tell me what you think.

Will Sony release the UX in the UK?

Cheers,

Howard.

[hayashikerubin]

The creation of the UX is said to be the birth of a new category of mobile devices, this is what i read about in an interview with one of the designers. so there is no question of a palm becoming a palmtop.

i am sure there will be people who like it.

[hayashikerubin]

i posted the details of the interview in one of the threads, anyone interested go take a look.

[Tron]

The UX is indeed a great unit - I tested one yesterday briefly, but will get a better chance later. Uses the same stylus type as NX73. Amazing screen, keyboard has a nice feel to it. The 3D style launcher felt slightly wierd using but you get the hang of it pretty quickly. Jog-dial. hmm not convinced of the positioning, compared to the positioning on other units. All in all a really nice little unit.
Yes it is getting a UK release.

[kjbad]

Deep Blue - unfortunately, I have had to follow up with several people who have gripped the tiny stylus in their hand ALL DAY and began to feel pain in their fingers from using their PDAs so much. Makes me wonder exactly what they do all day...but that's a different issue.

I do carry a BIC e.3 i- t's a pen, pencil, and stylus in a barrel about the size of a Dr. Grip pen for US $4. It is my ONLY stylus...forget the tiny ones that PDAs come with. I've actually bought a couple for employees that needed to change their grip. If I get a UX 50, it will still be my only stylus.

I may wait to buy a good used T- or NX- series, though...if the UX takes off, there should be plenty of those with the features I want on the resale shelves for a lot less.

[Deep blue Sky]

Originally posted by Unregistered
I am currently looking for a Palm / CE device to replace the HP Jornadas that my company uses for field engineers.

The UX looks a pretty good bet... something with a good screen and a keyboard that can run Cadenza from Commontime.

There are still lots of people who can type faster than they can write even on paper let alone on a PDA.

Long live the keyboard.

If anyone has actualy used a UX please post a message and tell me what you think.

Will Sony release the UX in the UK?

Cheers,

Howard.

May I modify your statement and make it "long live the full size keyboard"? The UX keyboard would be better used if it is used by the thumb. If you use it like a full size keyboard (ten figures) then I would think that Graffiti is faster.


I still feel (and I probably look like) I am playing with a playstation game pad than actually typing something on the thumb-boards because of the way I have to hold a device like NX. I feel more at ease when I use graffiti in front of my boss because I have to been writing something.

[nz007]

Originally posted by falafel



Ok, so its a Palm top, and not a Palm. Now help me understand, because i'm a bit confused.... Why should this make me "unhappy"? Did Sony corner me at gunpoint and say, "Buy the ux50 or else?"

I think it the idea of "moving" away from a "PDA" to a more ultraportable laptop like palmtop that dissapoints many clie fans.

Sony has also coined the new term "PEO-pesonal entertainment organiser" as a move "away" from PDA's in genral.

for $700 it is fairly expensive especially when you can buy a state of the art ultra-portable laptop from Samsung for an extra $300

[hausman]

But I bet you can't fit that ultraportable laptop (despite "ultraportable") in your pocket...and there's a price premium for some folks to be able to carry a thumbpad communications device around in your pocket, discreetly.

I do take deep blue sky's comment about looking like you are playing games - I get that a lot with the Zaurus, but I just wave it in the air and say "email". Then they're usually intrigued and start asking how I'm connected, and then they learn all about this "bluetooth" thing of which I speak...LOL

[Uncle Steve]

My vision:

Open up the cam shell and flip or slide out the 'wings' on the bottom section to expand to a full size keyboard (sort of a built-in Stowaway keybd).


"Everything would be OK if everyone would just listen to me."
----- Gore Vidal

[Unregistered]

If this thing had a GSM radio I'd buy it in a heartbeat. Even w/o it, my fearless prediction is the the UX series will essentially kill sales of of NX/NZ series.

Flame on.

X

[n2ifp]

Originally posted by Unregistered
If this thing had a GSM radio I'd buy it in a heartbeat. Even w/o it, my fearless prediction is the the UX series will essentially kill sales of of NX/NZ series.

Flame on.

X

Why?

Did the Ford Mustang kill the sales of a Ford Truck?

[Unregistered]

more like did the pinto kill truck sales :)

[Hexnut]

To each his/her freakin own....

[Unregistered]

Hey Larry, your truck/mustang analogy is off the mark. What you're failing to see is that the UX and NX/NZ series are more similar than they are different. trucks and mustangs share 4 wheels, and not much else.

the UX and NZ/NX share: the existence of a keyboard (i.e. primary focus as a messaging device), a 320x480 screen, a screen that pivots to allow tablet use, wifi & bluetooth (either built in or via accessories).

You freaks are so hung up on the landscape orientation of the UX that you're blinded to how similar these devices are. And as a message device, landscape makes WAY more sense.

We'll see in unit and $ sales. The UX kills the NX/NZ...

X

[n2ifp]

Now wait a minute, the V8 that's in my truck is the same V8 in the high performance Mustang, although my truck is almost twice as heavy :).

Now, who says other models won't have improvements over what's existing now. Additionally the NZ is not a big seller, also the UX is rather pricey for some.

I have said from the beginning that the UX will be hit, but it's not for everyone, especially those who want a "T" form factor. That is okay, the whole point that there is something for everyone. If the current line of Clies stayed status quo, then I would agree with you 100%. Sure it will bite into sales, but I don't think it will kill other models. I am sure there will be a NZ90 replacement along the way too.

I just find it amusing how hostile some seem because a new model was introduced. Whether others like it or not, I like the UX50 so far, but I want to know more. My major concern is it's perfomance, will it be a Mustang or a truck?

;)

[Unregistered]

A lot of people bashed the folks who bought and loved the NZ, too.

Boils down to people being greatly disappointed about UX. Want a "T" form, go to Palm.

Not a Mustang, most of which are hardly high-end anymore or a truck. More like a tank ;).

[TheZodiac]

They are giving people options.. its one line, its not going to take over the world - Good god. Everything else they make is "traditional".

[ksjenkins]

Originally posted by n2ifp


Why?

Did the Ford Mustang kill the sales of a Ford Truck?

 

I think Larrys analogy is right on! Essentially the same guts just a different package.

UX = Built in WiFi, Bluetooth and a little more memory (smaller screen, low-res camera) maybe a better battery.

NX= Optional WiFi, CF Slot, Large screen, good battery life, HigherRes Camera.

It's all about what suits you best. I prefer to go fast, but don't have a need for a truck!

:D

[ballistic]

I think 'Unregistered' is way off in his/her prediction of the UX killing the NX/NZ. I prefer the NX orientation; it's more natural and like a pad of paper, easier to use/navigate one-handed.

The jog dial placement and lack of portrait orientation on the UX make it impractical/unintuitive to use in this manner. When Jeff Hawkins made his wooden mockup for the original USR Pilot (http://www.brighthand.com/article/Does_size_really_matter) , he didn't design it to hold 'sideways' like the UX.

The traditional form factor/portrait orientation is alive and well, the UX is merely Sony doing what Sony does best; innovating.

It will not kill the portrait/tablet form factor devices.

[Orincarnia]

wow i never knew thats how palm came about......sounds like something i would try......hmmmm maybe i can make a bunch of money by dragging a wagon full of wood to make a portable entertainment system, ya think it could work?

[ballistic]

No.

I don't think there is a big market for Quaker or Mennonite home theaters or portable entertainment systems.

[druss]

well I have the NX80 and love it and cannot or am not interested in anything else unless the upgrade the nx again. i love the shape and more memory, it is great. dr

[n2ifp]

Originally posted by ballistic
No.

I don't think there is a big market for Quaker or Mennonite home theaters or portable entertainment systems.

LOL :D!

[n2ifp]

Originally posted by druss
well I have the NX80 and love it and cannot or am not interested in anything else unless the upgrade the nx again. i love the shape and more memory, it is great. dr

That's fine, I have the NX80 too, nothing wrong with it, but I still want the UX for ME ;)

[Orincarnia]

well if you have that kinda money to spend then hand down your nx 80 to me, I'LL BE HAPPY TO RECIEVE IT!!!!!

[Unregistered]

Orincarnia - don't hold your breath

[Orincarnia]

don't worry i'm not, it was a joke........thats why you register, get a sence of humor and then we'll treat you like a human

[Unregistered]

Someone should do a little homework on various religious communities before being a smart aleck -

"I don't think there is a big market for Quaker or Mennonite home theaters or portable entertainment systems. "

Practices differ widely from community to community and this includes the watching of TV and movies. Most who do not have chosen not to b/c of the violence on TV and in the movies not the technology and a desire to keep life as simple as possible.

Perhaps you were thinking of the Amish?

[Orincarnia]

not again........unrgistered users need to either get out, lighten up, or register

IIIIIIITTT WWWAAASSS AA JJOOKKEE!!!!!!!!!!

when joking it doesn't mean it has to be accurate........and i dont' think any amish people or quakers or even mormons are gonna come around here sayin "but we don't use electronics" wanna know why? cause they don't use electronics

by the way anyone seen asterisk around recently?

[Orincarnia]

i wonder if anyones gonna try and correct the mormon thing.....

[Unregistered]

again, you are wrong but then you are 17 and can't spell, too.

[Orincarnia]

screw you psycho, go register then you may hold ground otherwise go back to your happy little amish home and let us chat amongst our selves

or i'll use something more suitable to you

this is an a & b conversation so c yo way out of it

thats more your time old fart

[ballistic]

Originally posted by Unregistered
Someone should do a little homework on various religious communities before being a smart aleck -

"I don't think there is a big market for Quaker or Mennonite home theaters or portable entertainment systems. "

Practices differ widely from community to community and this includes the watching of TV and movies. Most who do not have chosen not to b/c of the violence on TV and in the movies not the technology and a desire to keep life as simple as possible.

Perhaps you were thinking of the Amish?

You're right, I was thinking of the Amish. I stand corrected. Duly noted. I don't think there is a big market for Amish home theaters.

Again, a joke and not meant to be offensive or a display of my ignorance of various religions.

Jesus, Buddha and Allah walked into a bar...

What was this thread about again?

Prediction: The UX is not a mistake, it will do well but not kill sales of the NX/NZ. Sony will kill those sales when it comes out with more innovative models that make the NX and NZ obsolete. Sony has a very good track record of doing that, except for the T-Series which hasn't really been updated and fully replaced.

[Orincarnia]

lol i guess i was a little stupid last night towards the unregistered dude, oh well too bad hes not here to be apologized too

[nauta]

I used to be the proud owner of a Sharp Zaurus ZR-5000FX. Actually, I still own it. It was the coolest piece of technology, with touch-screen, a keyboard, and a detachable 2400 baud modem I could dial into BBSes and in later years, check email over my ISP. The fact that it had a keyboard was infinitely useful for word processing and taking notes.

When I got my Palm IIIe, I marvled at the size, but it wasn't practical for taking notes in class. I couldn't afford the $100 keyboard at the time. The Palm was great for keeping information at hand, but for entering much more than a phone number or a memo, it was useless.

The UX-50 harkens back to the day of the keyboard-ehnaced PDA (K-PDA as Sharp self-proclaimed the Zaurus as being, I recall, in the manual). It expands Sony's product line to include those of us who want a Palm with a *usable keyboard* - what a concept!

I'm looking forward to putting my 8.5x11" spiralbound notebook away and using a 4.5x3.5" Clie instead.

[Unregistered]

Originally posted by ballistic


Prediction: The UX is not a mistake, it will do well but not kill sales of the NX/NZ. Sony will kill those sales when it comes out with more innovative models that make the NX and NZ obsolete. Sony has a very good track record of doing that, except for the T-Series which hasn't really been updated and fully replaced.


I personally don't think the UX would do well because 1) Business users will either buy TG (BT) or NX (Wi Fi) if they prefer and save on the difference. 2)The ones that want the latest toy would hold off for T3 and because it is not ergonomically design for convenient hand use (maybe convenient thumb use).

I have no problem with Sony coming up with something more innovative, it is just that innovation should be a well-rounded idea, not specific technological improvement. Ergonomics and design are definitely issues that need to be addressed. The story of the iMac says it all. As it is now it looks like a kid's spelling dictionary.

[Deep blue Sky]

I posted the above thread.......

[nauta]

Originally posted by Unregistered



I personally don't think the UX would do well because 1) Business users will either buy TG (BT) or NX (Wi Fi) if they prefer and save on the difference. 2)The ones that want the latest toy would hold off for T3 and because it is not ergonomically design for convenient hand use (maybe convenient thumb use).

I have no problem with Sony coming up with something more innovative, it is just that innovation should be a well-rounded idea, not specific technological improvement. Ergonomics and design are definitely issues that need to be addressed. The story of the iMac says it all. As it is now it looks like a kid's spelling dictionary.

1. The TG is understandable if someone just wants Bluetooth connectivity on their Clie. However, the NX-73 ($499) coupled with a WiFi card ($149) is only $50 less than an all-in-one solution like the UX. And if people like the portrait orientation, so be it, but I think Sony hit it right when they decided to make a web-browsing machine landscape oriented. I'd certainly rather scroll vertically than horizontally myself.

2. The ones who want the latest toy are never satisfied; they're the people who end up buying a new model every three months because that's how fast the technology moves. The T3 and the UX both have their market niche, and both have their own advantages depending on the crowd. I, personally, have always wanted a Clie-caliber PDA with a keyboard for word processing and a landscape screen. My only concern is the battery life of the UX-50, but considering it does so much, I should hardly be surprised.

Like has been said, ergnomics has been addressed in the UX; just a different kind of ergonomics than apparently you're looking for. A usable keyboard isn't something you'll find on any other PDA, certainly not a "thumbboard". If you want one-handed use, get an NX with a WiFi card. If you want integrated wireless and a web-oriented screen (landscape), with keyboard input, get a UX. Every new series Sony releases expands their product line to cater to a wider range of users, and the UX fits the bill for many, including myself.

[jklfafa]

sure u can say it looks cool, but i think the waves look dumb, i know its suppost to help by making it easier to type, but its so dumb looking, i love the jornada 690 keyboard, just the perfect sizee

[Deep blue Sky]

Originally posted by nauta


1. The TG is understandable if someone just wants Bluetooth connectivity on their Clie. However, the NX-73 ($499) coupled with a WiFi card ($149) is only $50 less than an all-in-one solution like the UX. And if people like the portrait orientation, so be it, but I think Sony hit it right when they decided to make a web-browsing machine landscape oriented. I'd certainly rather scroll vertically than horizontally myself.

2. The ones who want the latest toy are never satisfied; they're the people who end up buying a new model every three months because that's how fast the technology moves. The T3 and the UX both have their market niche, and both have their own advantages depending on the crowd. I, personally, have always wanted a Clie-caliber PDA with a keyboard for word processing and a landscape screen. My only concern is the battery life of the UX-50, but considering it does so much, I should hardly be surprised.

Like has been said, ergnomics has been addressed in the UX; just a different kind of ergonomics than apparently you're looking for. A usable keyboard isn't something you'll find on any other PDA, certainly not a "thumbboard". If you want one-handed use, get an NX with a WiFi card. If you want integrated wireless and a web-oriented screen (landscape), with keyboard input, get a UX. Every new series Sony releases expands their product line to cater to a wider range of users, and the UX fits the bill for many, including myself.


I don't have a NX, but I would think that since Kinoma player can do landscape display, they would be able to figure out how to do landscape in NX (if not already). On the other hand the reverse is not true (the spec specifically says it would only be in landscape). If you have a long list of things to do (which is part of what PDA is originally design to do), then you might have to scroll a lot.

For word processing a clie with a Stowaway XT will be much faster than thumb. thumb-boards for extending word processing would be really hard.

I would agree that there would be a crowd that use this machine, the critical point is that this machine is positioned so narrow that the NX and TG could fill the gap easily and that the demand for it would be low due to it high price (more than the two). That is why it would be a failure.

[ss1543]

The shape may be great, I would need to play for a while. However after having 64meg on my Palm TC I could never go back. I lived with the memory on the NX NR but never again.

[Idiots!]

Isn't change and DIFFERING designs a good thing. There is no "one form fits all". Not defending or attacking the UX...it is good to see the expansion of the genre from the "original intent" of the product line.

If it is too "different" for you, pass on the UX and get something else.

VARIETY AND FREE THOUGHT IS GOOD.

Regardless, KUDOS to Sony for pushing the envelope and not being afraid of ostrasizing some diehards (and blowhards!).

Me

[dúnadan]

If this thing had more RAM, I'd get it.

[ballistic]

Originally posted by Unregistered



I personally don't think the UX would do well because 1) Business users will either buy TG (BT) or NX (Wi Fi) if they prefer and save on the difference. 2)The ones that want the latest toy would hold off for T3 and because it is not ergonomically design for convenient hand use (maybe convenient thumb use).

I have no problem with Sony coming up with something more innovative, it is just that innovation should be a well-rounded idea, not specific technological improvement. Ergonomics and design are definitely issues that need to be addressed. The story of the iMac says it all. As it is now it looks like a kid's spelling dictionary.

I think you're missing the whole point of the UX. It is a different form factor that will appeal to mobile users who want a clamshell.
Many users will not like the design or prefer the tradional portrait/tablet PDA, others will like the landscape orientation and larger keyboard in clamshell mode and the option of one handed use in a landscape/tablet mode. I am surpised that the UX will not do portrait with VG in tablet mode.

Check out Brighthand'sarticle (http://www.brighthand.com/article/Time_for_a_Clamshell_Pocket_PC) about the clamshell making a comeback.

[n2ifp]

Hmm, I thought ergonomics and design were being addressed?

I want the table model, not a handheld model

[Deep blue Sky]

Originally posted by ballistic


I think you're missing the whole point of the UX. It is a different form factor that will appeal to mobile users who want a clamshell.
Many users will not like the design or prefer the tradional portrait/tablet PDA, others will like the landscape orientation and larger keyboard in clamshell mode and the option of one handed use in a landscape/tablet mode. I am surpised that the UX will not do portrait with VG in tablet mode.

Check out Brighthand'sarticle (http://www.brighthand.com/article/Time_for_a_Clamshell_Pocket_PC) about the clamshell making a comeback.

That depends on how you call a clamshell. TG-50 to me looks like a clamshell because it opens up like a clamshell, but just that the shell itself does not have anything whereas the shell of NX it a tablet. I am not against clamshell in that respect (protection being a good argument) but it is more a keyboard vs VG question.

In that respect are you missing my point?

[Deep blue Sky]

Originally posted by Idiots!
Isn't change and DIFFERING designs a good thing. There is no "one form fits all". Not defending or attacking the UX...it is good to see the expansion of the genre from the "original intent" of the product line.

If it is too "different" for you, pass on the UX and get something else.

VARIETY AND FREE THOUGHT IS GOOD.

Regardless, KUDOS to Sony for pushing the envelope and not being afraid of ostrasizing some diehards (and blowhards!).

Me

Agree with no "one form fits all", but then by referring to it as a mistake Sony is going after a relatively small crowd that wants exactly what UX does for them.

UX will be like the NZ-90 where a very limited number people would like. Sony later calls it a "prototype" for future development, which in a sense is true now that NX-80V comes out

If Sony really knows what customers they are trying to serve to reap the greatest profit and satisfies the most customers. VG in T form factor is the key.

[Unregistered]

Does anybody know if orders are coming for Sony US?

[Orincarnia]

the only reason i find the tg not cool is cause the "clam shell" is useless you're sitting there with a thing sticking up off your clie and it looks stupid, now that theres a clear protector screen and sthe silicon keys i'll be more opted to get it,

maybe i should have posted this in the tg foruim

[n2ifp]

Originally posted by Unregistered
Does anybody know if orders are coming for Sony US?

Next month around September 9th.

[sonicboy]

dont like it? dont buy it.

I guess everyone is entitled to their opinion, even if its wrong :D

[Unregistered]

NX80V i will get one!

[Orincarnia]

looks like you're not gettin one unregistered, there was a good amount of threads talking abotu how the nx is 3.8 and the ux is only 3.2 in........it sucks i know

[Unregistered]

UX 50 is seriously a dog!

the performance is slow, battery is only half of what NX is! (Somebody tell me this is a joke)

http://pocketgames.jp/modules.php?op=modload&name=Reviews&file=index&req=showcontent&id=110

babelfish translation (the caption under the battery benchmark 2.0)

UsingBatteryBench2, it measured the battery continual drive time with full power. As for result in 2 hour 15 minute 05 seconds back light off. Also ƒ�ƒ‚ƒXƒe becomes unable to use. As for this shock! In just the standard battery, as for application of wireless LAN and Bluetooth the one which is abandoned is better. As for NX73 4 hour 40 minutes, as for NZ90 4hour12 minutes, as for TG50 they were4hour 13 minutes for the reference.

[sonicboy]

yeah this models performance shocked me too but I feel bench mark results are misleading due to the new variable processor thing..

for example, the 3D launcher flys and the unit can play 30fps video however gets a low score.. I think there is more to it

[JackAxe]

This thread should be relabeled as the new Undead Thread.

<]=)

[Unregistered]

Originally posted by sonicboy
yeah this models performance shocked me too but I feel bench mark results are misleading due to the new variable processor thing..

for example, the 3D launcher flys and the unit can play 30fps video however gets a low score.. I think there is more to it

but other processor can do 30fps and still have long battery life too. Granted it has VGA screen but it hardly makes any different if it is that tiny.

the video accelerator? there is no application exploiting it. Sony might as well say how the UX supports telepathic ability for those user who are telepath. As of now the graphic accelerator only means 3D launchers... hardly worth all the hype and price.

[JackAxe]

Muuhahhahhahhhah, this thread lives on..... It is EVIL!!!

<]=)

[sonicboy]

I see... dont tell me I gotta dust off my C++ books dammit

I can already see several applications that need arm/os5 support