Do I need Cleanup and Uninstall Manager?

[ws808]

Uninstall Manager was the first application I installed in my NX60. Now that I'm thinking of buying the program, I'm wondering if I should buy it with Cleanup.

The Cleanup page on the northglide site says, "Leftover files and preferences survive hard-resets; the HotSync Manager restores them one by one to your device.
Cleanup will help you get rid of them once and for all."

I don't really understand what this means, but I suspect it's suggesting that even if you have Uninstall Manager installed from the beginning, you should still install Cleanup?

Or is that being paranoid?

Thanks for your help. This is my first post.

[Tixx]

Personally I have them both: In short, Uninstall Manager is prevention and Cleanup is more reaction to past installations. Great apps and great customer service I might add:)

[notmuch]

If Uninstall Manager was the first app you loaded, and if UM works as promised, you have no need for Cleanup. Cleanup is for anything installed before UM.

[Tixx]

Originally posted by notmuch
If Uninstall Manager was the first app you loaded, and if UM works as promised, you have no need for Cleanup. Cleanup is for anything installed before UM.

notmuch has it correct and here is from their site:)

"...To analyze and get rid of old leftovers that already inhabit your device, use Cleanup v2; to prevent your device from being a victim to future shareware products, use Uninstall Manager."

[WS808]

Sorry I didn't login correctly the first time.

I should have mentioned in my original post that Northglide support said:
"In most cases you will not need Cleanup.
Having Cleanup installed as well, is always a good step to take in order to make sure your device stays clean."

I wanted to know what the other "cases" might be in which I would need Cleanup, so I posted the question to you experts here.

Thanks for the replies!

[tanker_bob]

I looked at Cleanup and even tried it, but it isn't a panacea. You really have to know what each preference entry is--a daunting if not impossible job. Uninstall Manager itself can be very helpful, but the OS 4 version crashed my T665C all the time. The OS 5 version may be more stable.

[Jeremyf]

Hi,

I've also recently installed both Cleanup and UninstallManager..

I feel completely overwhelmed by cleanup - it shows dozens of entries and I have no clue what can be deleted and what can't be!! How does one deal wit hthis? Also, it seems like you can only delete one at a time..

Jeremy

[PalmGearJenn]

Originally posted by Jeremyf
Hi,

I've also recently installed both Cleanup and UninstallManager..

I feel completely overwhelmed by cleanup - it shows dozens of entries and I have no clue what can be deleted and what can't be!! How does one deal wit hthis? Also, it seems like you can only delete one at a time..

Jeremy

I agree, it is overwhelming. I would rather see an option to delete all the "junk" en masse.

[tanker_bob]

Originally posted by PalmGearJenn


I agree, it is overwhelming. I would rather see an option to delete all the "junk" en masse.
Same here. The problem with Cleanup is that most everything gets listed as "junk". The first time I tried it, I thought that I had the options set wrong. I deleted it when I realized it was serious and stuff like my Datebk5 preferences were orphans. Cleanup is a noble idea, but the implementation leaves much to be desired.

[Jeremyf]

If anyone has contact info for the author, might be worth e-mailing him/her the link to this thread.

Jeremy

[n2ifp]

I only use the delete in the pull down menu in the default launcher that I have used for years and what developers have told me to use when beta testing.

The less stuff you have running at the same time the better! It only adds complexity and more chances for something to go wrong. I keep my Clie running lean and mean :)

I look and monitor the creator ID's via Filez (freeware on PalmGear), which is a file manager. For identification, I use the following Palmsource creator ID database.

http://dev.palmos.com/creatorid/

Every file has a 4 character creator ID and it's case sensitive. Most of the files associated with an app, have the same or similar creator ID.

This might be a tad too technical for you, but you at least have the option of knowing more of what some power users do.

I would rather see you put your money towards something like PowerRun that will allow you to run apps that have associated databases from the memory stick so as to make more efficient use of the Clie's RAM memory.

[Tixx]

Originally posted by Jeremyf
If anyone has contact info for the author, might be worth e-mailing him/her the link to this thread.

Jeremy

If you have questions and such, here is the contact info:Roy Perry at NorthGlide Systems [info@northglide.com].

[tanker_bob]

I exchange some emails with the developer over Uninstall Hack locking up my T665C. He lost interest after a couple of notes, and I lost interest in his software.

[notmuch]

Originally posted by n2ifp
I only use the delete in the pull down menu in the default launcher that I have used for years and what developers have told me to use when beta testing........

I look and monitor the creator ID's via Filez (freeware on PalmGear), which is a file manager. For identification, I use the following Palmsource creator ID database.

http://dev.palmos.com/creatorid/

Every file has a 4 character creator ID and it's case sensitive. Most of the files associated with an app, have the same or similar creator ID.....

Good advice, but the problem (as you know) is some apps create files with multiple creator ID's, multiple saved and unsaved prefs, and the standard delete function doesn't catch all of them. Uninstall Manager (&hack) seems like a nice solution because it eliminates exactly what you are doing: manually monitoring .pdb's and creator ID's via Filez. Also the ID database at Palm.com is by no means complete.

I'm testing Uninstall hack on the POSE, and I'm curious if anybody else has had problems on OS 4.1 ala Tankerbob? Also agree with others that it is virtually impossible to get completely cleaned up with "Cleanup". The only sure way is to hard reset, and install everything manually. A pain indeed.

[Sid]

Originally posted by tanker_bob
I exchange some emails with the developer over Uninstall Hack locking up my T665C. He lost interest after a couple of notes, and I lost interest in his software.

He lost interest!?
I hope his app is freeware then. How can a developer lose interest in constructive feedback (as I assume yours was) from a user and potential customer?

[Tixx]

Originally posted by Sid


He lost interest!?
I hope his app is freeware then. How can a developer lose interest in constructive feedback (as I assume yours was) from a user and potential customer?

Actually, my experience is quite the opposite as he has promptly responded to every e-mail that I have ever sent him and always helped me to the end on any issues I was having:)

[tanker_bob]

It isn't freeware. I exchanged two rounds of email w/o resolution, with my last email going unanswered. I was just seeking a solution to the lockups on Hotsync and was ready to buy if an answer or even a good idea was presented. The developer recommended disabling hacks during Hotsync, but that's my standard configuration anyway. In fact, I couldn't even disable Uninstall Hack manually in X-Master. Only a soft reset followed by not reenabling hacks enabled me to delete Uninstall Hack from my system. No criticism, constructive or otherwise, was tendered. No resolution was reached, so I never bought it.

[sfringer]

I've had no problems running Uninstall Hack (both the older 1.x and newer 2.x releases) on my T615C. I've experienced no lockups with regard to any hacks I run (not too many) and HotSync (I leave them enabled during HotSync).
Like Tixx, I too have had good response from Roy at NorthGlide, and he even cut me a deal to purchase CleanUp v2 for a discount (since I registered UninstallHack long ago, and didn't want to take advantage of the current bundle he's offering.) He's also worked with me on creating signatures for CleanUp v2 which are what are needed to help make sense of all of the 'leftovers' it finds.
Wish I could offer a solution to Tanker_Bob, as it is a nice piece of software (especially for folks who either beta test a good deal, or just like to try out everything under-the-sun)

Scott

[DanT]

I rather spend the money for buying more useful apps since you can identify creator IDs by the PalmOS search tool mentioned earlier and by freewares like LeftOvers (http://palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?prodID=45238) and SysTool (http://palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?prodID=43684).

Both LeftOvers and SysTool can list saved and unsaved preference creator IDs and owners for apps in RAM and in MS. FileZ can only do it for apps in RAM. LeftOvers can do one more thing too, that is identifying the owners of databases.

To keep your system free of orphans, you just need to get the discipline of identifying the creator IDs of an app before you delete the app (and of course do a MSBackup before venturing to the unknowns). So, after you delete the app, you can check the "unknown" owner of those preferences and databases. If their creator IDs match with the app that you have just blown away, you know then that those are orphans and you can safely delete them. If you goof, you can always restore the original RAM with the MSBackup.

[Tixx]

Originally posted by DanT
I rather spend the money for buying more useful apps since you can identify creator IDs by the PalmOS search tool mentioned earlier and by freewares like LeftOvers (http://palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?prodID=45238) and SysTool (http://palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?prodID=43684).

Both LeftOvers and SysTool can list saved and unsaved preference creator IDs and owners for apps in RAM and in MS. FileZ can only do it for apps in RAM. LeftOvers can do one more thing too, that is identifying the owners of databases.

To keep your system free of orphans, you just need to get the discipline of identifying the creator IDs of an app before you delete the app (and of course do a MSBackup before venturing to the unknowns). So, after you delete the app, you can check the "unknown" owner of those preferences and databases. If their creator IDs match with the app that you have just blown away, you know then that those are orphans and you can safely delete them. If you goof, you can always restore the original RAM with the MSBackup.

Not many people have those kind of patients, time or the want to even go through all that when Uninstall Manager will simply do it for them:)

[n2ifp]

All they need to do is use the delete in the default launcher. How complicated can that be, never mind...

[valodya]

I just came across Inwatch Uninstaller.

http://www.palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?prodID=39732

Has anyone tried this one? Seems to do the same thing (and according to them, of course does it better). What are the pros and cons?

[Tixx]

Originally posted by valodya
I just came across Inwatch Uninstaller.

http://www.palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?prodID=39732

Has anyone tried this one? Seems to do the same thing (and according to them, of course does it better). What are the pros and cons?

You have to play around with that one before every installation of any files last I know. Like make a complete list of all your apps prior to installing. Completely inconvenient in my opinion. Esp when you do as much testing and trying as much new software as myself.

[Hannibal]

Originally posted by Tixx


You have to play around with that one before every installation of any files last I know. Like make a complete list of all your apps prior to installing. Completely inconvenient in my opinion. Esp when you do as much testing and trying as much new software as myself.

Regarding InWatch Uninstaller. I've been playing around with it tonight. Seems to work well. Allowed it to do a full cleanup on prior apps installed and did not lose any registration info, etc. You can set it to do an automatic snapshot prior to hotsyncing, so it seems pretty automated. Haven't tried Uninstall Hack. Has anyone here tried both and chose InWatch? By the way, I have been using PrefMgr for along time with no problems, but I like the idea of InWatch better so far.

[bobbd]

I, like Tanker Bob, have had stability issues with Uninstall Hack while evaluating. In fact, I e-mailed the developer about an hour ago and was amazed to get an immediate reply. We've exchanged a few e-mails so far so we'll see what happens. That kind of response is amazing - like ZZTechs. Just the fact that he responded so fast on a weekend is impressive. Most developers don't respond right away. I hope he can resolve the problem.

Bob

[hherbzilla]

I bought InWatch before ever hearing about Uninstall Manager. However, now that I've played around with UM, I do prefer it over IW. I'm not sure if IW outperforms UM, as is contended on the web site. I've done a few of my own tests and they seem to work equally well.

Although IW can automatically take a snapshot at each HotSync, it still has some associated problems. For example, if you install more than one app during the sync then all of the "bits" get thrown together in IW. I've also had the situation where my Handstory clips were included with an app I just installed. In that example, you can manually remove the extraneous files, but still.

The great thing about UM is that there's no thought involved. You don't have to be careful about taking a snapshot before you install, you don't have to install apps separately to ensure they get recorded as unique apps, etc. I think that's how we would all prefer to operate.

The only question remains: Does InWatch do a better job of removing the orphans and, if it does, is it worth the extra hassle? In my mind, it doesn't matter... I'll go with Uninstall Manager because it's so much easier to use.

[Tixx]

Originally posted by bobbd
I, like Tanker Bob, have had stability issues with Uninstall Hack while evaluating. In fact, I e-mailed the developer about an hour ago and was amazed to get an immediate reply. We've exchanged a few e-mails so far so we'll see what happens. That kind of response is amazing - like ZZTechs. Just the fact that he responded so fast on a weekend is impressive. Most developers don't respond right away. I hope he can resolve the problem.

Bob

I love great customer service too:)

[Tixx]

Originally posted by hherbzilla
I bought InWatch before ever hearing about Uninstall Manager. However, now that I've played around with UM, I do prefer it over IW. I'm not sure if IW outperforms UM, as is contended on the web site. I've done a few of my own tests and they seem to work equally well.

Although IW can automatically take a snapshot at each HotSync, it still has some associated problems. For example, if you install more than one app during the sync then all of the "bits" get thrown together in IW. I've also had the situation where my Handstory clips were included with an app I just installed. In that example, you can manually remove the extraneous files, but still.

The great thing about UM is that there's no thought involved. You don't have to be careful about taking a snapshot before you install, you don't have to install apps separately to ensure they get recorded as unique apps, etc. I think that's how we would all prefer to operate.

The only question remains: Does InWatch do a better job of removing the orphans and, if it does, is it worth the extra hassle? In my mind, it doesn't matter... I'll go with Uninstall Manager because it's so much easier to use.

Convenience plays a major role in my selection of apps as well. The average user does not have the continued patients for IW nor do people that try software like crazy, i.e myself:)

[Hannibal]

Originally posted by hherbzilla


The only question remains: Does InWatch do a better job of removing the orphans and, if it does, is it worth the extra hassle? In my mind, it doesn't matter... I'll go with Uninstall Manager because it's so much easier to use.

Thanks for the info! Yes, I'm leaning toward Uninstall Hack (I'm running an SJ30, so can't use Uninstall Manager). I have gotten used to leaving all hacks off a lot of the time. I had a number of problems with crashes associated with hacks on a Handspring Visor Pro (which I never was able to resolve), so I am a little gunshy of them. Not being a hack is the plus for me that InWatch offers. I will leave just Uninstall Hack active all the time and see how that goes. I do like the simpicity of Uninstall Hack.

[bobbd]

Originally posted by bobbd
I, like Tanker Bob, have had stability issues with Uninstall Hack while evaluating. In fact, I e-mailed the developer about an hour ago and was amazed to get an immediate reply. We've exchanged a few e-mails so far so we'll see what happens. That kind of response is amazing - like ZZTechs. Just the fact that he responded so fast on a weekend is impressive. Most developers don't respond right away. I hope he can resolve the problem.

Bob
Just to bring everyone up to date, I determined that I only had problems on my laptop at work where I use PocketMirror and sync to Outlook. This was discussed by e-mail with NorthGlide Systems on Saturday and Sunday. Guess what, when I tried duplicating the problems on Monday, I could not. Damned if I know what the difference was, but I will now proceed with my evaluation of Uninstall Hack. One things for sure, I won't worry about developer support if I decide to purchase.

Bob

[Tixx]

Originally posted by bobbd

One things for sure, I won't worry about developer support if I decide to purchase.

Bob

Yep, very good customer support indeed:)