oh great, OS 6.0 is coming....

[likestech]

What is with the love-hate relationship Palm has with its customers? I am still waiting for OS 5.0 upgrades to Presenter-to-go and a Stowaway keyboard for my NZ90...when I read that OS 6.0 will be released soon. Sometimes I wonder why bother? I understand that this is not entirely Palm's fault and that they are responding to competitive pressures from PocketPC, but does anyone ever think about the consumer first anymore? [some of the steam i am blowing off is because i gotta upgrade my iPOD also].

http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1103-1000110.html

[hansschmucker]

Palm is actually doing pretty well, since OS1-4 applications are compatible with OS5, and even OS5 ARM applications will be compatible with OS6

[rhart00]

I heard all OS5 apps will be compatible with OS6.

[mlrtime]

I've never done a palm OS upgrade before, anyone care to speculate what will be involved? Will NZ users have to pay for OS6?

Thanks,
mlr

[hausponce]

My fingers are crossed. I hope, if there is an upgrade to OS6 it's a software based one.

[hansschmucker]

POS6 doesn't need any new hardware. Palmsource has already confirmed that any hardware capable of running OS5 will be able to run POS6, but it's up to the hardware manufacturers to reprogram their custom OS5 extentions for OS6 (i.e. programming an OS6 interface for the Yamaha chip which delivers sound on the NX/TG devices)

[MikeD]

I always thought that with palm devices, you always had to just go out and buy a whole new pda to get the OS. I mean, how often do you see Palm OS 5 sitting their on the shelves of CompUSA like windows XP, or Mac OSX sitting up there... I guess they don't build the os's to last...

[TechnoCat]

Originally posted by likestech
What is with the love-hate relationship Palm has with its customers? I am still waiting for OS 5.0 upgrades to Presenter-to-go and a Stowaway keyboard for my NZ90...when I read that OS 6.0 will be released soon.You might try rereading the article. The second sentence said, and I quote precisely:Devices using the latest version, OS 6, likely won't be available until early to the middle of next year, he added.
That means your definition of soon would encompass nearly a two year timeframe, certainly an 18 month one, given that OS5 was released last autumn!

Give poor Palm a break. Two years is not a short customer-abusing timespan. It might be too long, but it certainly isn't too short!

[GeekGod]

Originally posted by hansschmucker
Palm is actually doing pretty well, since OS1-4 applications are compatible with OS5, and even OS5 ARM applications will be compatible with OS6 Not all OS1-4 apps are OS5 compatible. I'm sure the situation will only get worse with OS6.

But at least we'll get more memory...

[likestech]

Too short?! You either have no idea about the process of software development or you only care about yourself.

An OS is not just any software program; third-party developers rely upon a reasonable path for OS upgrades or they waste their own development efforts. Consequently, if an OS developer upgrades too quickly or too often you not only harm end users, but you frustrate third-party application developers who often cannot keep up. If you're like Microsoft, you probably don't care about customers or third-party developers, but Palm is generally not perceived to be like that.

[pigburger]

Aren't we assuming the Palm can hit a date? C'mon people, we will be lucky to see a unit ship by the end of the year. And it won't nearly be as a leap for developers because it will be based on the same processor, which was always the main issue with OS 5. OS 6 will be a more robust OS 5.2, I biggest hope will be that it will mean less custom developed Sony APIs. It's not that big of a deal...

[GeekGod]

"...but does anyone ever think about the consumer first anymore?"

That's the problem with progress. There really is no way to make substantial progress without obsolescence. If Palm stuck to the Motorolla CPU and just continued to improve the old OS they would stay nearly 100% compatible, but consumers would soon be moving on to shineyer, newer devices and OSes. Not nessesarily because they are better, mind you. The average consumer doesn't have a clue about better. They just want newer, prettyer, "faster", etc.

On the other hand, if Palm does what they are doing now, people feel they are victims of "planned obsolescence" and "forced upgrades" and there really is no solution (if you know of one, please enlighten the rest of us).

The most difficult times are what we are in right now. The transition period of major change. Trying to maintain a degree of compatibility with the past, while building an entirely new base for the future.

Devices and products introduced during this transitional period are kludges. Neither here nor there. They sorta work with the old stuff, but don't really improve it much, and kind of offer some next gen features, but are not fully realized. While software produced during this period becomes bloated as it tries to run on both the old and the new.

OS5 is the beginning of the "kludge" stage, and the currently offered PDAs are the "beta" devices. OS5.2/5.3/5.4, etc. are the beta patches that will try and "fix" the short comings of the kludge products, but it's still a kludge. OS6 will be more functional and less compatible, but will probably still be somewhat of a kludge. Hopefully by OS7 or 8 we will have left the past behind.

And if and when that happens, the last remaining dinosaurs will scream long and hard about how Palm abandoned them...

[TechnoCat]

Originally posted by GeekGod
Hopefully by OS7 or 8 we will have left the past behind.

And if and when that happens, the last remaining dinosaurs will scream long and hard about how Palm abandoned them... Nice analysis. On the screaming... could be, but that's several years down the line. Anybody still running a Palm III or 505 at that point isn't buying enough equipment and software to be profitable to Palm or anyone else.

Very few current programs will run on Win95. Programs designed explicitly to optimize the new Mac OS and hardware, don't run on the old. And, oddly, my DVDs won't play on my record player. People are accustommed to having to stay current or make do. Oh sure, there might be some luddite hermits somewhere in a few years, holed up with their ancient 160x160 DragonBall 20MHz 8MB Palms while the rest of us are whizzing along at 1GHz, 256MB, with the new Sony HandPlasma Clie running 1024x1024 resolution (with the optional 40-pound battery pack), but remember... when the hermits are holed up away from technology, nobody hears their screams of anguish when their downloads don't run.

[likestech]

True enough. Yall have made good points. I guess it comes down to two points for me: I would neither call anyone who uses an NZ90 today a luddite, nor find it a good business practice to build in an 18 month practical obsolescence for an expensive Palm-based PDA like the NZ90. We will see if Sony agrees soon enough.

[pigburger]

It's only obsolete if it doesn't meet your needs anymore!!! Nissan comes out with new Maximas every year but I don't run around complaining I'm driving an obsolete car and upgrading every fall. It's the nature of consumer electronics, if your TV is more than 2 years old, chances are, they don't make it any more. Does that mean yours is obsolete and you need to upgrade?

I think people confuse obsolecence with an obsessive/compulsive urge to have the lastest and greatest techno gadget.

[n2ifp]

Originally posted by pigburger
It's only obsolete if it doesn't meet your needs anymore!!! Nissan comes out with new Maximas every year but I don't run around complaining I'm driving an obsolete car and upgrading every fall. It's the nature of consumer electronics, if your TV is more than 2 years old, chances are, they don't make it any more. Does that mean yours is obsolete and you need to upgrade?

I think people confuse obsolecence with an obsessive/compulsive urge to have the lastest and greatest techno gadget.

I think your right, too many are also busy trying to impress others too :D.

OS6 is slated for early next year, by then I cound be dead :D, LOL!

[cbulock]

Originally posted by pigburger
It's only obsolete if it doesn't meet your needs anymore!!! Nissan comes out with new Maximas every year but I don't run around complaining I'm driving an obsolete car and upgrading every fall. It's the nature of consumer electronics, if your TV is more than 2 years old, chances are, they don't make it any more. Does that mean yours is obsolete and you need to upgrade?

I think people confuse obsolecence with an obsessive/compulsive urge to have the lastest and greatest techno gadget.

Yea, thats exactly right. Oddly, I don't really understand why everyone is think Palm is screwing them by releasing OS6. They have had OS6 planned as long as OS5 was planned. It's always been know that OS5 was a stepping stone from the 'old stlye' Dragonball Palms to the 'newer' ARM Palms. OS6 will be great, it will probably finally work out all the little kinks Palm OS has developed by trying to add on advanced features to a simple OS, such as expansion cards and wireless. It's even designed to run with the same hardware requirements and will still have the PACE layer to run all the older software. And we will get programs that can be written fully in ARM code. I can only see this upgrade as being a good thing.

[kdn102]

Well, here is one point of view in which you can complain:

If Nissan came out with a new car every year, with a catch. It only works with 60-70% of the oil out there. So those who make the incompatible oil will need to change their manufacturing process each year.

[nx70vboy]

os 6 is gonna be dope

[yobbo]

Originally posted by pigburger
I think people confuse obsolecence with an obsessive/compulsive urge to have the lastest and greatest techno gadget.

Obsessive/compulsive...now that what it's all about. The original Palm meets my needs but I upgraded 3 times in as many years and now have the NZ90. Probably never will use all the available features...but dam it's a kool gadget.

I hope it's a software upgrade from OS 5 to 6 at least that way I'll get a year or 2 to boost the gadget bank for the next must have toy.

[pigburger]

Originally posted by kdn102
Well, here is one point of view in which you can complain:

If Nissan came out with a new car every year, with a catch. It only works with 60-70% of the oil out there. So those who make the incompatible oil will need to change their manufacturing process each year.

How much of the latest software is OS5 only? I think I see the opposite happening, there are so many OS4 units out there a lot of publishers cater to them. An excellent example is Billiards, megasoft released an OS 5 version of it but I still use the OS4 version because it supports hi-res+ while the OS 5 version doesn't. Some companies may release an ARM optimized version of a program but to stop development on OS4 is simply bad business. There will always be high quality apps available for OS4, they may not be the most cutting edge in 2 years so they will still be useful.

There comes a time when everyone will want to upgrade because there will be something out there with a feature set that they truly want. Don't let Palm or Sony dictate that timeline to you. My parents have a PC with an AMD K6-2 450 that they paid $1500 for like 6 years ago. Until there's a piece of hardware or software that is compelling enough to them, they won't upgrade. They don't care that they can't run Windows XP or Office XP because they are perfectly happy with Windows 98 and Office 97. Does that make them weird in my eyes, yes, but then I think of all the mangers I've worked with who have Palm Vx (for some reason they ALL have Vx's) who barely take them out of the cradle. I think they are more representative of the average Palm user than the enthusiasts who patrol this boards and similar boards.

[pigburger]

Originally posted by yobbo


Obsessive/compulsive...now that what it's all about. The original Palm meets my needs but I upgraded 3 times in as many years and now have the NZ90. Probably never will use all the available features...but dam it's a kool gadget.

I hope it's a software upgrade from OS 5 to 6 at least that way I'll get a year or 2 to boost the gadget bank for the next must have toy.

It's very obsessive, a friend and I bought our first Palm IIIx's on the same week. He still has and uses his and I'm on my fifth device since. My name is Todd and I'm a palmaholic...

[ashVID]

All the more reason to avoid buying any new Sony device until OS6 is released. Sony will have an intermediate upgrade sometime this year but hold off, the intermediate units depreciate the most. Just wait for an OS6 device...


ash =o)

[likestech]

ashVID, I wish I had followed your advice. I like the NZ90, no doubt about that, but there is no keyboard for it yet and Margi doesn't have an OS 5.0 driver yet. In other words, this thing is hardly a laptop replacement for me and probably will not be until....hmm...OS 6.0 devices appear? Dare I say I should have purchased a Pocket PC device like the IPAQ. I hear that MS does a better job with coordinating its OS upgrades with third-party application developers, but I don't have high hopes for us early adopters no matter where we take our money.

[pigburger]

There are 3rd party PPC applications?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?



:)

[Unregistered]

Actually, I was referring more to the companies that had to fix their software to work correctly on OS5.

Originally posted by pigburger
How much of the latest software is OS5 only? I think I see the opposite happening, there are so many OS4 units out there a lot of publishers cater to them....